Hi all, I am a wildlife and fisheries student at WVU and my professor has found a 50 gallon tank and wants to keep native species from the area. We currently have a few different darters, I believe some rainbow and greenside but not sure. I volunteered to help care for the fish and tank. What medium should i put in the bottom of the tank, what should I feed them and what other species go well with darters?
Question about native care
Started by
Guest_mountaineer_*
, Sep 23 2010 08:00 PM
6 replies to this topic
#2
Guest_donkeyman876_*
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Posted 23 September 2010 - 08:14 PM
Welcome to the forum mountaineer. Sand or small gravel will work, if you plan on planting the tank there are many other mediums which will work, everything from kitty litter to dead leaves. I've never kept darters but the will eat froen black or bloodworms. Search around the forum and you will find loads of information.
#3
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Posted 24 September 2010 - 04:43 AM
welcome to the forum mountaineer,Hi all, I am a wildlife and fisheries student at WVU and my professor has found a 50 gallon tank and wants to keep native species from the area. We currently have a few different darters, I believe some rainbow and greenside but not sure. I volunteered to help care for the fish and tank. What medium should i put in the bottom of the tank, what should I feed them and what other species go well with darters?
i have had good luck keeping daters with orange spot sunfish and some of the smaller shiner species then some top minnows.
i have had bad luck in the same tank when i added crawfish and a madtom stonecat.
i used just river gravel and hornwort this made for a nice tank with darters in bottom water column shiners in the middle and top and northern studfish in the upper water column.
species used in tank were.
daters, Etheostoma blenniodes, E variatum, E caeruleum.
shiners, Notropis hudsonius,Cyprinella whipplei, Notropis rubellus, Luxilus chrysocephalus this last one got to big and i had to move him.
sunfish, Lepomis humilis, Ambloplites rupestris.
top minnow, Fundulus catenatus.
i found this mix of fish to be a little pricy to feed they mostly ate frozen brine shrimp, frozen blood worms and freeze dried myiss shrimp. i was unable to convert this tank over to flake or pellet foods.
Edited by CATfishTONY, 24 September 2010 - 04:56 AM.
#4
Guest_EricaWieser_*
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Posted 24 September 2010 - 09:23 AM
If you've got darters, the two things I have to ask you is if you have a powerhead to create strong current in the tank (if not, you should go get one) and if you've got an aquarium heater in there (if you do, take it out).
Next is the issue of food. I feed my Orangethroat darters (Etheostoma spectabile) sinking Wardley shrimp pellets and frozen cocktail shrimp (the kind you can buy at the grocery store) that I've grated through the fine holes in a cheese grater. They also eat live adult brine shrimp, live bloodworms, live ramshorn and Physa fontinalis snails, and my other fish's fry. And they possibly eat the leeches that are in my aquarium.
Next there's what to put in the bottom of the aquarium. Someone mentioned kitty litter earlier. That's because of these webpages (very interesting) which use Special Kitty brand litter from Walmart, which has no anti-clumping chemical additives.
1. Substrate Analysis (What Is It?): http://www.thekrib.c...rate-jamie.html
2. Cation Exchange Capacity (Does it sustain itself over time?): http://www.thekrib.c...te-jamie.html#1
3. Photos of tank with kitty litter substrate (Proof Plants Like Kitty Litter): http://www.plantedta...trate-i-do.html
In conclusion, kitty litter works great as a substrate for rooted plants.
A lot of fish live in planted environments in the wild, and the planted tank is just an effort to reproduce the fish's natural habitat. If you look at Elijah's tanks, you'll see some excellent examples of planted native tanks: http://forum.nanfa.o...10716-my-tanks/
Those are just beautiful.
And darters do climb up into plants. They utilize the space to hunt and explore. Picture of proof:
http://img.photobuck...imiru/019-3.jpg
http://img.photobuck...imiru/023-1.jpg
http://img.photobuck...imiru/022-1.jpg
And if you read the book Ecology of the Planted Aquarium by Diana Walstad, you'll see that it is easier and healthier for the fish to live in an aquarium with live plants as compared to an aquarium without. So that's why a live plant or two in the tank is a good thing.
Of course, you don't need to have rooted plants (a lot of plants float or are attached to wood or such like). But if you do have rooted plants, they won't grow well in gravel. Gravel's just basically silicon dioxide, and has no nutrients for plants. If you mix some kitty litter into the gravel, there are nutrients available to the plant roots, and they grow better.
AAaaaaanyway, that's a really long explanation, and I'm sorry for it. Basically as long as you have a powerhead and your tank's maximum temperature doesn't go above 75 F, your darters will be fine. They'll be lovely.
So, a last comment. Yes, it is possible to wean them on to flake foods. It just takes a few weeks. And they of course like live foods better; it's just a matter of whether or not you want to / are able to feed them live bloodworms every day. If your local pet store sells them frozen, in cubes, try them.
And I am a fan of that cocktail shrimp with the cheese grater idea. My darters love it, especially when the shrimp bits are floating in the current, dancing around a bit. And it's very affordable to buy a bag of frozen shrimp.
Good luck
Next is the issue of food. I feed my Orangethroat darters (Etheostoma spectabile) sinking Wardley shrimp pellets and frozen cocktail shrimp (the kind you can buy at the grocery store) that I've grated through the fine holes in a cheese grater. They also eat live adult brine shrimp, live bloodworms, live ramshorn and Physa fontinalis snails, and my other fish's fry. And they possibly eat the leeches that are in my aquarium.
Next there's what to put in the bottom of the aquarium. Someone mentioned kitty litter earlier. That's because of these webpages (very interesting) which use Special Kitty brand litter from Walmart, which has no anti-clumping chemical additives.
1. Substrate Analysis (What Is It?): http://www.thekrib.c...rate-jamie.html
2. Cation Exchange Capacity (Does it sustain itself over time?): http://www.thekrib.c...te-jamie.html#1
3. Photos of tank with kitty litter substrate (Proof Plants Like Kitty Litter): http://www.plantedta...trate-i-do.html
In conclusion, kitty litter works great as a substrate for rooted plants.
A lot of fish live in planted environments in the wild, and the planted tank is just an effort to reproduce the fish's natural habitat. If you look at Elijah's tanks, you'll see some excellent examples of planted native tanks: http://forum.nanfa.o...10716-my-tanks/
Those are just beautiful.
And darters do climb up into plants. They utilize the space to hunt and explore. Picture of proof:
http://img.photobuck...imiru/019-3.jpg
http://img.photobuck...imiru/023-1.jpg
http://img.photobuck...imiru/022-1.jpg
And if you read the book Ecology of the Planted Aquarium by Diana Walstad, you'll see that it is easier and healthier for the fish to live in an aquarium with live plants as compared to an aquarium without. So that's why a live plant or two in the tank is a good thing.
Of course, you don't need to have rooted plants (a lot of plants float or are attached to wood or such like). But if you do have rooted plants, they won't grow well in gravel. Gravel's just basically silicon dioxide, and has no nutrients for plants. If you mix some kitty litter into the gravel, there are nutrients available to the plant roots, and they grow better.
AAaaaaanyway, that's a really long explanation, and I'm sorry for it. Basically as long as you have a powerhead and your tank's maximum temperature doesn't go above 75 F, your darters will be fine. They'll be lovely.
So, a last comment. Yes, it is possible to wean them on to flake foods. It just takes a few weeks. And they of course like live foods better; it's just a matter of whether or not you want to / are able to feed them live bloodworms every day. If your local pet store sells them frozen, in cubes, try them.
And I am a fan of that cocktail shrimp with the cheese grater idea. My darters love it, especially when the shrimp bits are floating in the current, dancing around a bit. And it's very affordable to buy a bag of frozen shrimp.
Good luck
Edited by EricaWieser, 24 September 2010 - 09:27 AM.
#5
Michael Wolfe
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Posted 24 September 2010 - 11:31 AM
You are already getting good advice, so I will just add a "lazy guys" perspective to this... since you are a college student and dealing with a tank in a semi-public area you probably need to KISS - Keep Is Simple Student.Hi all, I am a wildlife and fisheries student at WVU and my professor has found a 50 gallon tank and wants to keep native species from the area. We currently have a few different darters, I believe some rainbow and greenside but not sure. I volunteered to help care for the fish and tank. What medium should i put in the bottom of the tank, what should I feed them and what other species go well with darters?
Substrate can really be anything... it all depends on what you are trying to do... if plants, then there is one answer. If you want it to look natural maybe another. But to KISS, use a small or fine aquarium gravel.
Feeding is easiest with frozen foods (brine shrimp, bloodworms, etc.) for the darters. They will eat it right away and you dont have to worry to much about anything other than having a freezer to keep it in. And Erica is right, eventually the rainbows will take flakes... especially if you feed some flakes at the same time, which I am going to recommend because...
Tank mates... go with a school (7-10) of shiners. You can have others, but these will be the easiest to maintain and be active right away... and they will eat the flakes that I mention above. Maybe rosyface shiner Notropis rubellus would be nice... local to you I think... there may be some local species splits to pay attention to, but I think that is a common one up your way that would have some color and be hardy and common.
Either write something worth reading or do something worth writing. - Benjamin Franklin
#6
Guest_nativeplanter_*
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Posted 24 September 2010 - 03:52 PM
I would agree with Michael. At least at first, the KISS method may be the best way to go; later you can try more things as you feel more comfortable. Especially if it is in a public viewing area. Spare time for maintenance can be hard to come by at certain times in the semester, as I'm sure you know.
I think a lovely tank would have medium-size gravel with some rocks and a nice specimen of driftwood. You do need good flow, but how you get it can vary. A powerhead would be best, but if you get some good turbulence using just the filter outlet then that can be fine too. Some people like the flow to be directional (like a stream), but if you want to KISS, it isn't necessary. So long as there is decent flow/turbulence then there should be enough gas exchange, and the fish will still play in the currents and create a lovely display. (Wow... I just advocated a non-planted tank.)
If you add shiners to the tank (which I agree would look very nice), you might find that they are getting to the food before the darters. A simple trick to try is creating a darter feeding station in a back corner using a piece of pipe that is maybe an inch or so in diameter. Dump thawed foods into the top of the pipe, and it will fall to the bottom without the shiners intervening. Darters are pretty smart critters, and they will even learn to gather at the station at feeding time.
I think a lovely tank would have medium-size gravel with some rocks and a nice specimen of driftwood. You do need good flow, but how you get it can vary. A powerhead would be best, but if you get some good turbulence using just the filter outlet then that can be fine too. Some people like the flow to be directional (like a stream), but if you want to KISS, it isn't necessary. So long as there is decent flow/turbulence then there should be enough gas exchange, and the fish will still play in the currents and create a lovely display. (Wow... I just advocated a non-planted tank.)
If you add shiners to the tank (which I agree would look very nice), you might find that they are getting to the food before the darters. A simple trick to try is creating a darter feeding station in a back corner using a piece of pipe that is maybe an inch or so in diameter. Dump thawed foods into the top of the pipe, and it will fall to the bottom without the shiners intervening. Darters are pretty smart critters, and they will even learn to gather at the station at feeding time.
#7
Michael Wolfe
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- Board of Directors
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- North Georgia, Oconee River Drainage
Posted 24 September 2010 - 07:55 PM
If you add shiners to the tank (which I agree would look very nice), you might find that they are getting to the food before the darters. A simple trick to try is creating a darter feeding station in a back corner using a piece of pipe that is maybe an inch or so in diameter. Dump thawed foods into the top of the pipe, and it will fall to the bottom without the shiners intervening. Darters are pretty smart critters, and they will even learn to gather at the station at feeding time.
In my experience, if you feed flakes first, the shiners get all excited about chasing things around in all that turbulent flow... then if you have your brine shrimp that you thawed by putting them in a little bit of water in a juice glass... you can kind of 'dump' them in the tank rather vigorously, and they will get to the bottom pretty quickly and the darters will be able to get them... and with all the mix of flakes and frozen, the darters will start eating some of the flakes and... there you go!
Either write something worth reading or do something worth writing. - Benjamin Franklin
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