It seems often I am of two minds on the local fish. At times admiring and defending them, at times overcome by envy of other peoples fish. I am of the latter currently.
I went fishing in a part of the Ashuelot I never tried before. It used to have a mill dam but now it is filled with swift rocky water. No luck fishing and with a dip net on me I entered the icy water (we still have snow in the shady spots) and started kick netting with no luck.
I then thought on my luck kicknetting such areas. The few longnose dace i get are from their but few and far between, on occasion I get a blacknose but they seem to prefer slower streams or the borders between riffles and slower streams, On one trout stream I got a couple sculpin like this, and netted a salmon once. But by and large riffles are fishless here. My experience on New York (back when it was fishable) and Virginia are similar areas are rich in all kinds of darters and minnows.
Riffles are considered very important sampling spots, so many riffle trips, heck even a section of American Currents is called Riffles. So I have to ask, where are all the riffle fish I hear about?
where are the riffle fish?
Started by
Guest_FirstChAoS_*
, Apr 03 2011 11:27 PM
8 replies to this topic
#2
Guest_EricaWieser_*
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Posted 04 April 2011 - 07:50 AM
Could it be that you're too slow for them and they're escaping you? Riffle fish are fast. I went out collecting last fall and even though I could see them, I couldn't catch them. You could try a bait trap or a different net type and see if you get different results.
You could also take a sample of the water there and take it to a lab and see if something's poisoning it.
You could also take a sample of the water there and take it to a lab and see if something's poisoning it.
Edited by EricaWieser, 04 April 2011 - 07:51 AM.
#3
Michael Wolfe
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Posted 04 April 2011 - 08:19 AM
It used to have a mill dam but now it is filled with swift rocky water. No luck fishing and with a dip net on me I entered the icy water (we still have snow in the shady spots) and started kick netting with no luck.
Riffles are considered very important sampling spots, so many riffle trips, heck even a section of American Currents is called Riffles. So I have to ask, where are all the riffle fish I hear about?
There is sampling technique invovled... there is also structure involved... and of course weather has an effect... sometimes the fish are there and you just cannot get them in the net.
Technique: is hard to describe and I assume you have done this before, so I will skip that one.
Structure: what size are the rocks in this "swift rocky water"? I have seined some places and got nothing, despite the fact that we could actually snorkel and see the fish. They were able to avoid the seine by essentially hiding under rocks that were too big to be moved when we did the "darter shuffle".
Weather: there have been a lot of discussions here about where do the fish go in winter... and the short answer is that they are no in the shallow frozen water. So you may be too early for your area. Also, I had a very difficult time this weekend finding the fish I wanted to see becasue of a recent rain that had the river I was in rushing around much faster and much deeper than normal and displaced all teh fish from where I knew they had been jsut a few weeks ago.
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#4
Guest_NVCichlids_*
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Posted 04 April 2011 - 08:29 AM
It took me almost ALL of last years trips to learn how to sample these areas and I am still not very good. I wish you luck as this is the area where I found some of the more beautiful colored rainbow darters (typical rainbows are awesome, these were 10x better!)
#5
Guest_gerald_*
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Posted 04 April 2011 - 11:17 AM
When the water is very cold, riffle-dwelling fish have less reason to spend time (and waste energy) in fast water, since they're not breeding and they don't need much food. They're probably spending more time in slower, deeper water, or scour holes under big boulders and logs.
#6
Guest_keepnatives_*
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Posted 04 April 2011 - 11:18 AM
You have a couple main problems:
1. It's still cold out there
2. You have much lower numbers of potential riffle fish then do NY and especially Virginia even if it was warmer
Just here in my area of NY we have more darters that like riffles (rainbow, greenside, fantail, logperch) VA has double those. Then consider the difference in species of dace, shiners, chub and minnows that may at any time be in the riffles in those states plus sculpins and madtoms. It's just not a even playing field .
1. It's still cold out there
2. You have much lower numbers of potential riffle fish then do NY and especially Virginia even if it was warmer
Just here in my area of NY we have more darters that like riffles (rainbow, greenside, fantail, logperch) VA has double those. Then consider the difference in species of dace, shiners, chub and minnows that may at any time be in the riffles in those states plus sculpins and madtoms. It's just not a even playing field .
#7
Guest_jblaylock_*
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Posted 05 April 2011 - 08:44 PM
I think most of your problem is the temp. When it is cold, I find most darters in slower moving water. Usually close to a riffle, possibly near the bank, or in a back-cut, or leaf pile. Once the temp consistantly warm up, the darters will move to the riffles to spawn. They usually remain there until the follow temp drop. It's true that you don't have a huge variety. Also, it took me a while to learn a good technique. When I first started darter hunting I chased greensides for hours to catch one, now I have a good technique for kick-seining.
#8
Guest_FirstChAoS_*
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Posted 06 April 2011 - 02:48 AM
I think most of your problem is the temp. When it is cold, I find most darters in slower moving water.
I find all my local darters in slower moving water as well. Then again my state only has tesselates who like slower current in my experience and swampys (which i have yet to look for) which like still water.
Your post made me wonder though, do certain fish only utilize riffles at certain times of the year?
#9
Guest_Skipjack_*
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Posted 06 April 2011 - 06:07 PM
Temps are a big factor. Beyond that there are dozens of micro- habitats within a riffle. Moving a few feet may make a big difference. Substrates are huge. Currents are a big deal as well. It is a skill. And sorry to say, I firmly believe that some people are natural fishermen, and some are not. Fishermen think like fish, and can tell you right where a smallmouth is hiding, or in this case, where a logperch? will be located in a riffle. Though much of it is an acquired skill, and you will learn as you go, you have to think like a fish. "the fish ain't bitin" is not acceptable, you try different techniques, and you will catch fish. Keep working the riffles all over top to bottom, pay attention to the tailouts (where they turn into pools) and you will find them if you put your time in.
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