I own a seine and I was wondering if there was any chance I could catch a pumpkinseed or an orange spotted sunfish with it? We tried yesterday but only got bluntnose shiners, johnny darters, round gobies, and crayfish. Would a barbless hook work better? Do traps work on sunfish? Should we look in shallow rocky riffles or the sandy shore or deep pools? Are rivers, streams or ponds better?
What's the best method to catch pumpkinseed and orange spotted sunfish?
Started by
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, Jul 05 2011 09:17 AM
32 replies to this topic
#2
Guest_Drew_*
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Posted 05 July 2011 - 09:30 AM
I don't know the regulations of OH but in most states you have to catch all "game fish" with hook-n-line or rod-n-reel or some variation. There are some states that treat certain species as "bait" and are handled differently.
If you can find where they are, a small barbless hook with worms will work pretty well.
If you can find where they are, a small barbless hook with worms will work pretty well.
#3
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Posted 05 July 2011 - 10:01 AM
Pumpkinseeds are found in still water, generally speaking, and most any pond will have them unless it was built/stocked without them. You can find them in rivers as well, but they aren't going to be found in the riffles, except maybe by accident as they're passing through. I recently caught a tiny one (maybe 1.5") on a hook from under a rock next to Tinker's Creek (at the Hemlock Creek Picnic Area) just adjacent to some pretty swift moving water. The Ohio DNR's A-Z fish website has good info about the habitats and behavior of virtually all fish found in Ohio, as well as pictures for nearly all and tips for identifying them. Pumpkinseeds are classified as sport fish in Ohio, so you're not allowed to take them with a seine.
Orange spotted sunfish are apparently found in slow moving muddy waters, according to the DNR. Their site lists them as having no special status, but because of where you find them they'd probably be difficult to get with a seine. I'd call the DNR and ask whether they count as bait fish or not if you're in the mood to give it a try.
If you're fishing for them, a small hook with a piece of waxworm or mealworm on it works wonders. You'll have to sort through all the bluegill you catch at the same time, but you'll catch them eventually.
ETA: Removed some fail, added some link.
Orange spotted sunfish are apparently found in slow moving muddy waters, according to the DNR. Their site lists them as having no special status, but because of where you find them they'd probably be difficult to get with a seine. I'd call the DNR and ask whether they count as bait fish or not if you're in the mood to give it a try.
If you're fishing for them, a small hook with a piece of waxworm or mealworm on it works wonders. You'll have to sort through all the bluegill you catch at the same time, but you'll catch them eventually.
ETA: Removed some fail, added some link.
Edited by jasonpatterson, 05 July 2011 - 10:05 AM.
#5
Guest_fundulus_*
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Posted 05 July 2011 - 10:18 AM
You'll generally find both species in fairly shallow water near shore, but in very different habitats. As mentioned above, o-spots prefer slow moving usually muddy areas, and p-seeds are usually found over some kind of gravel or sand in ponds.
#10
Guest_frogwhacker_*
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Posted 22 July 2011 - 07:28 PM
I catch small sunfish quite often in my wire minnow trap in the Little Muskingum river. Just an ordinary minnow trap. My daughter and I enjoy observing them and releasing them. I usually catch them where the water is a little calmer, but not necessarily still. I've also caught them in isolated holes in the late summer when the water is down. They sure are cute little fellers. Good Luck.
#11
Guest_IvanMike_*
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Posted 27 September 2011 - 02:42 PM
Traps work very well and the mouths can be widened easily. Meat based baits seem to work much better than the old bread standby - It's expensive, but i find a few freeze dried krill stink enough to bring them in droves. Often it's easiest to locate them by sight first and then use the trap - many times you can observe it and pull when you get a bunch - you can also select what size you're going after this way. Seines and dipnets can work, but sunfish are a LOT smarter than most.
however, as you may have to angle for them (which from both responsible and thoughtful ecological and management POVs is absurd, but what can you do...) the barbs can be bent down with a needle-nosed pliers faster than you can file them. Sunfish swallow the bait in a heartbeat, so if possible use the largest hook you can, and try to sight fish so you can set the hook instantly (a sensitive graphite rod also helps). Angling for aquarium fish is a lot different than angling for the joy of it or to eat some nice sunfish fillets.
however, as you may have to angle for them (which from both responsible and thoughtful ecological and management POVs is absurd, but what can you do...) the barbs can be bent down with a needle-nosed pliers faster than you can file them. Sunfish swallow the bait in a heartbeat, so if possible use the largest hook you can, and try to sight fish so you can set the hook instantly (a sensitive graphite rod also helps). Angling for aquarium fish is a lot different than angling for the joy of it or to eat some nice sunfish fillets.
Edited by IvanMike, 27 September 2011 - 02:42 PM.
#12
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Posted 30 September 2011 - 11:42 AM
Just a thought - are orangespotted sunfish considered a game-fish where you live? If not, they may be exempt from only being legally collected via angling. I think they top out at 15 cm, so I can't see them being a game-fish.
#13
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Posted 30 September 2011 - 11:58 AM
I haven't checked OH, but it wouldn't surprise me at all that they are orange spots are considered game fish. It's one of those rules that is set to make enforcement easier, and that's about it. They're not saying they really are a targeted species, but are trying to avoid arguments with the enforcement agents.
#14
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Posted 30 September 2011 - 12:19 PM
I haven't checked OH, but it wouldn't surprise me at all that they are orange spots are considered game fish. It's one of those rules that is set to make enforcement easier, and that's about it. They're not saying they really are a targeted species, but are trying to avoid arguments with the enforcement agents.
The best I can tell, in Ohio, orange spotted sunfish are the only Lepomis that isn't considered a game fish or "sportfish". This link lists them as "no special status" while all other Lepomis' are listed as "sportfish"
http://www.dnr.state...87/Default.aspx
Here is a link to get to the other Lepomis' or any Ohio fish status.
http://www.dnr.state...13/Default.aspx
I would hate to say for sure though if that makes them exempt from only being legally collected with a hook but, assuming we can use the terms "gamefish" and "sportfish" interchangeably, it is an interesting question.
Steve.
Edited by frogwhacker, 30 September 2011 - 12:27 PM.
#16
Guest_IvanMike_*
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Posted 30 September 2011 - 03:15 PM
Not that I'm advocating illegal collection, but I do advocate lobbying for law changes. In particular, bluegill are a huge problem in CT. They are an introduced species, and it's hard to find the native redbreast and pumpkinseed lepomis as the gills outcompete them. From a "game" perspective, bluegill spawn so much that they ruin local waters in terms of angling as they overpopulate and stunt. The best thing you could do is to trap and keep/destroy/feed to really big fish legions of the trap-able bluegills. Removing the ones that will take a hook doesn't solve the problem (considering they're impossible to eradicate (just ask Portugal or Puerto Rico.
Anyhow, if the law says you don't have to angle for spots, I think the idea of copying the law and taking it with you while you use a minnow trap is a good one.
Anyhow, if the law says you don't have to angle for spots, I think the idea of copying the law and taking it with you while you use a minnow trap is a good one.
#17
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Posted 30 September 2011 - 07:35 PM
Earlier this year I was at one of mt regular spots collecting darters and orangespots. I had caught the orangespots on hook and line including a couple small ones that would seem almost impossible to catch on a hook (around 1 to 1 and a half inches). A wildlife officer had been watching me seine for darters and asked to check my bucket. I let him and he noticed my orangespots. I assured him they were caught on hook and line but he wasn't 100% convinced. And said I couldn't keep them. I agreed to let them go to avoid a ticket. And as he was leaving I picked my rod and reel and caught another small one. I was going to show him but he was already gone. By the way this was Ohio.
#19
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Posted 01 October 2011 - 06:08 AM
That's insane. I guess carrying a copy of the law is crucial, as is talking to an intelligent person in the relevant dept. I'm surprised that you couldn't show him the obvious hook wounds (they are characteristic) on the spots you caught via angling. What strikes me as the most absurd is that in most cases there is no minimum size or numbers limit for sunfish, yet you must angle for even the wee ones.
I can see people trying to trap/net endangered species on the CARES program, only to be forced to put them back while a bulldozer wipes out the stream at the same time.
I can see people trying to trap/net endangered species on the CARES program, only to be forced to put them back while a bulldozer wipes out the stream at the same time.
#20
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Posted 01 October 2011 - 10:36 AM
I also have a copy of state laws regarding concealed weapons in a vehicle in the glove box. It doesn't stop a New Orleans or Houston cop from stealing a gun, but it's good practice. I keep it next to my public waterways laws... Eventually, I'll probably just have a huge legal file in the car to cover all of my questionable activities.
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