Is that true that the silver carps in Americas were mutant carp? It's just Ive heard that silver carps do not jumping in their native habitats and I was wondering if most jumping carps come from a single carp or few carps that has this jumping mutantion?
Silver Carp's jumping ability orgins
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, Oct 24 2011 06:09 PM
15 replies to this topic
#2
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Posted 24 October 2011 - 08:02 PM
No, they're not mutants. Just a species of carp from Asia. I would bet that they do jump in their native habitats. All kinds of fish jump when spooked, but these guys are huge and very prone to jumping. It also helps that they are found in large numbers together.
http://en.wikipedia....iki/Silver_carp
http://en.wikipedia....iki/Silver_carp
#3
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Posted 25 October 2011 - 12:43 PM
They don't jump in their native waters. NANFA member Bob Hrabik (MO Dept Cons) is doing a big rivers exchange program with folks in China, and they thought that Bob was trying to pull a fast one on them when he alluded to their jumping.
As for a mutation, if your use of the word is the common vernacular - then ignore the rest of what I've written...
If not, I'd be extremely interested to see a paper presenting the evidence. I've seen all too many invasive species population-trend hypotheses supported based on finding founder effect. The evidence could as easily be explained as a spurious correlation, and the authors are committing gross Type 1 error.
Todd
As for a mutation, if your use of the word is the common vernacular - then ignore the rest of what I've written...
If not, I'd be extremely interested to see a paper presenting the evidence. I've seen all too many invasive species population-trend hypotheses supported based on finding founder effect. The evidence could as easily be explained as a spurious correlation, and the authors are committing gross Type 1 error.Todd
#4
Michael Wolfe
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Posted 25 October 2011 - 01:11 PM
I know we are talking about silver carp... but I saw some big head carp that jumped quite a bit in China... on TV last night... they were being harvested in large nets and several individuals jumped like crazy. Made me think that maybe the silver carp that we see jumping are doing so because they are 1) agitated and 2) crowded. Certainly, that is the case in the net harvesting situation. And might be a factor in North American rivers as their population booms.
Either write something worth reading or do something worth writing. - Benjamin Franklin
#5
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Posted 25 October 2011 - 01:17 PM
That, to me, is a much more viable hypothesis, and a great observation.
Sorry if I was hyper-sensitive to the genetic link... I have to listen to this so often, it just grates my skin. There is probably a intraspecific reason for most of the trends (or, like, Occams razor). So sorry it usually can't be worked out in a sterile lab! (People who know my situation can probably understand from where this is derived
)
Todd
Sorry if I was hyper-sensitive to the genetic link... I have to listen to this so often, it just grates my skin. There is probably a intraspecific reason for most of the trends (or, like, Occams razor). So sorry it usually can't be worked out in a sterile lab! (People who know my situation can probably understand from where this is derived
)Todd
Edited by farmertodd, 25 October 2011 - 01:21 PM.
#6
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Posted 25 October 2011 - 02:50 PM
So why we don't hear any reports about silver carps jumping and hit people in their native homeland or in other parts in the world?
#7
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Posted 25 October 2011 - 02:52 PM
What's name of tv show you saw last night about bighead carps jumping in China?I know we are talking about silver carp... but I saw some big head carp that jumped quite a bit in China... on TV last night... they were being harvested in large nets and several individuals jumped like crazy. Made me think that maybe the silver carp that we see jumping are doing so because they are 1) agitated and 2) crowded. Certainly, that is the case in the net harvesting situation. And might be a factor in North American rivers as their population booms.
#8
Guest_fundulus_*
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Posted 25 October 2011 - 05:01 PM
Jumping carp might be a "dog bites man" story in China, they've been living with it forever.
#9
Guest_butch_*
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Posted 25 October 2011 - 06:05 PM
It doesn't explain why our chinese fish biologist were surprised that these American silver carp jumping out of the water.Jumping carp might be a "dog bites man" story in China, they've been living with it forever.
#10
Michael Wolfe
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Posted 25 October 2011 - 07:38 PM
The show I saw on television was 'Extreme Fishing with Robson Green' according to wikipedia it was likely year 3 episode 3 original air date 31 May 2010. The fish were apparently in a lake and a large group of Chinese fisherman had apparently set a multi-kilometer net some days before and had it narrowed down to a smaller area. They emptied the net into a container and claimed to have in some cases captured 700,000 pounds of carp in one netting. Anyways as the net got smaller and the fish got denser, they jumped maybe 8-10 feet in the air.
As to why the Chinese scientists don't see this, I was trying to imply that maybe the fish are much more densely populated in the rivers in the US than the fish would ever be in their native China... maybe because they are often in lakes, or bigger deeper rivers... I don't know... just an observation and a hypothesis.
As to why the Chinese scientists don't see this, I was trying to imply that maybe the fish are much more densely populated in the rivers in the US than the fish would ever be in their native China... maybe because they are often in lakes, or bigger deeper rivers... I don't know... just an observation and a hypothesis.
Either write something worth reading or do something worth writing. - Benjamin Franklin
#11
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Posted 25 October 2011 - 08:31 PM
Maybe it depends on the alleged fish biologist, too....
#12
Michael Wolfe
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Posted 26 October 2011 - 12:53 PM
I don't think it matters... I've never really seen any fish biologist that could jump very high.Maybe it depends on the alleged fish biologist, too....
Either write something worth reading or do something worth writing. - Benjamin Franklin
#13
Guest_jblaylock_*
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Posted 26 October 2011 - 08:38 PM
I don't think it matters... I've never really seen any fish biologist that could jump very high.
Even when nearing off topic..your comedic timing is always right on
#14
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Posted 26 October 2011 - 09:06 PM
I've always read that their jumping is triggered particularly by the proximity of boat motors. Is it possible that the difference in observations has to do with differences ijn the types of boats commonly used in China vs the US?
#15
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Posted 27 October 2011 - 07:33 PM
As to why the Chinese scientists don't see this, I was trying to imply that maybe the fish are much more densely populated in the rivers in the US than the fish would ever be in their native China... maybe because they are often in lakes, or bigger deeper rivers... I don't know... just an observation and a hypothesis.
Maybe.... in their native habitat, they have natural predators that keeps the population in check?
#16
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Posted 16 June 2012 - 09:02 PM
do chinese motorboats do thirty miles per hour? a jumping fish is not news, and certainly not jumping fish in a net, a jumping fish seriously injuring someone is news, it's the speed of the boat that makes the story, and partially causes the jumping causing the fish, manatee, whale , or diver to become confused, and make wrong avoidance manuevers.
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