Posted 01 March 2007 - 11:04 PM
I hope we can start with a clean slate and put negative feelings behind us.
Please feel welcome here and know that we'll not tolerate any personal attacks. If any member here causes you to feel uncomfortable in any way (public or via PM) please feel free to contact any member of the staff. We're here to make this a friendly place to discuss native fishes, invertebrates and their captive care.
Again, feel free to PM me or any staff if needed.
Posted 02 March 2007 - 11:26 AM
Posted 06 March 2007 - 12:07 AM
Posted 06 March 2007 - 12:43 AM
There's no such thing as a worthless native fish.
To some people they're worthless fish...
If you love those fish, you should be flattered that people find them so worthy. I hope you're learning that native fish aquarists are not harming the fish or the ecosystem, but rather, are highly respective of both.
...to others they're nice additions to aquarium...
I don't respect wimps. If you're right, you're right. Stand by it. Just make sure you're right. And be willing to objectively admit when you're wrong. No judgements meant by that. I've stood corrected here before, when I was wrong. And I stand by my righteousness when appropriate. By all means, do the same. And I stand by my apology.
Still, just for the record, I do not tolerate being attacked personally and know I am a formidable opponent.
Posted 06 March 2007 - 01:00 AM
Huh? I thought I was trying to make up. If it didn't work out that way, Uland, delete the posts. You have the power!
I finally know who you are Ed! You're that kid I used to hang around with in grade school. The guy that could not resist poking a stick in the hornets nest.
Posted 06 March 2007 - 01:15 AM
Posted 06 March 2007 - 01:26 AM
You weren't poking with a big stick like the kid back in grade school but we at least want to give TurtleLover a chance to understand what we do.
I might have taken the time to let Turtlelover know that NANFA members are not the types to recklessly molest T&E fish. Our members as a whole take the time understand about the fishes in their natural environment and naturally want to know what fish we're looking at. I'm sure TurtleLover gets the main idea of what the forum members stand for but I'd sure ask her to look at NANFA mission and code of ethics.
Most here take fish from the wild but we also make good attempts at breeding these fishes and spend plenty of time observing fishes in the wild. I can't recall all the details of what sparked the original thread but I'd be willing to bet both TurtleLover and the forum membership have softened a bit from their original feelings.
Posted 06 March 2007 - 01:36 PM
Posted 06 March 2007 - 09:05 PM
I very much understand where you are coming from in a few statements you have made and have to say I DO AGREE on some of these. On a purely emotional standpoint it personally sickens me that the big toothy Ganoids I work with and am strongly trying to conserve are frequently impaled on a arrow by some Jethro by the hundreds or are caught by anglers only to have them killed, mutilated, dismembered or in more recent case Run over in a parking lot until ground into the gravel. (This last one made vomit swell up my throat and an anger that can not be described)
I also have quite literally watched my local area over the past years become over run with invasive species. I have witnessed the genocide of several species in just a few years. In my case these days when we see a darter in my study site it is treated as if it was the last one on the planet...The reason for this is is that in my area of the country it just might be.
My fellow staff here can verify this very obsessive and a bit nutty reactions I get when working with Gars or my position on Invasive species.
However... I can not as a single person educate all. I can only keep trying on what ever level I can to increase a positive perception of our native resources. Education is truly the key to many of the issues we face as conservationists and should be the number one priority for all of us that are involved in protecting and preserving our native flora and fauna. On the question of the article mentioned this was indeed the point of the article and the intention was to glorify and highlite our Non-game fishes. This is where I have to disagree about the purpose or validity of the article from your point of view. I do understand well your apprehensions in it's execution as it is vague in some areas that should have been better covered or at least stated clearly. The benefits In my opinion out weigh the negatives in bringing these fish to a forefront, even with the flaws in the article.
Anyhow I'm quite glad that you have come over here and that you are fully willing to participate here on the forum despite a really crappy introduction to us. I may disagree here and there but I do like your thinking and definitely want to welcome you here. I look foreword to having many discussions with you in the future.
Posted 09 March 2007 - 02:32 PM
I'm glad I found people here that see the beauty in the same fish that most see as ugly or unworthy. I can completely understand the amount of anger you feel towards the people harming a fish you bust your butt working to save. My babies were the Rio Grande Suckers, try explaining to a sports fisher why it's important to preserve sucker fish when they see them as trash. I'm sure you go through the same thing with your toothy friends. I wish I had a picture of my little suckers in spawning colors, they are the most brilliantly colored fish with broad black and red stripes and a black Zorro mask across their face. By the way, all my babies are brood stock size now. I'll probably be a grandma again this summer, even though I'm no longer there, they are still my babies.
Disenfecting the equipement became a second nature habit for me. I would often borrow equipment (with permission) from the facility to use in my classes at school (pimarily my waders). They got disenfected before they left and right when they came back. Here in the SW there's a lot of problems with whirling disease because it's so easily transmitted so we really try and be aware of that. God forbid we infect our native cutthroats and and destroy what few pure populations we have left.
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