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Native Planted biotope thread (Houston, Texas)

Started by Guest_mnemenoi_* , Mar 02 2013 07:41 PM

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17 replies to this topic

#1 Guest_mnemenoi_*

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Posted 02 March 2013 - 07:41 PM

I was recently asked to assist (setup and consult) a local nature center nearby in setting up a locally collected biotope type tank and wanted to bounce some ideas for what I believe I have to work with. The center stated it was a 20 gallon tank (unsure if it is a 20H or 20L) and that no one at the center had much experiance with aquariums. I was happy to assist as I know there are quite a lot of local schools that use the faciluty heavily for outings and such. I have some ideas and would be interested to hear opinions either way...

Substrate - Eco-Complete (I have a ton that is sitting dry and I could use) or perhaps collected sand from a nearby stream. I even thought about topping the eco-complete with it, but think it will eventually make a mixed up mess)

Lighting - I doubt they have anything that is very decent, so I'll likely just buy/donate a dual T5 fixture with 10,000K bulbs.

Filtration - Eheim 2211 with Purigen to control the tannins

Plants (Spring, Tx.) - Locally collected Sag, Floaters of some sort (look like red root, but local), Fissidens (not local per se, but found in Texas), Riccia, and anything else that I spot locally.

Hardscape - Locally collected dried oak and hardwoods branches that might work similar to Manzanita. I might use either Oak leaves or crush up some IAL for some substrate effect.

Livestock - Gammarus, Ghost Shrimp (Paleomontes sp.), Golden Topminnow ( Fundulus chrysotus) 1M/2F, Possibly a Banded pygmy perch (unsure about adding it as they are difficult to feed), Ramshorn snails (if they get too far out of control I can add some assassins and just remove them at a later time), Tadpole Madtom (if I can find one)

Lighting schedule of 8-10 hours daily on a timer, for ease of control

Dosing - No CO2, so I will recommend Excel dosing, with a compliment of Seachem Flourish and Iron. With either substrate I'll start with root tabs and maintain a 6 month schedule for maintanance.

Some issues I would appreciate feedback on

-I tried working other options over in my head, but can not seem to find any other loacally viable species in a tank that small.
-I think the plants should work with a dual T5 light and dosing, but minimal care is to be expected
-Is a tank like this doable with me only being able to do care every 2 weeks?

Any ideas or suggestions would be appreciated and once I have a plan and get approval I will take some pics as the tank gets built.

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#2 Guest_mnemenoi_*

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Posted 02 March 2013 - 07:56 PM

Not sure if this is the correct area for this topic, but the mods are welcome to move it to wherever is most appropriate. (Was unsure if plants, Captive Care, or Regional might be the most appropriate)

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#3 Guest_EricaWieser_*

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Posted 02 March 2013 - 08:02 PM

-I tried working other options over in my head, but can not seem to find any other loacally viable species in a tank that small.

Elassoma zonatum are found in Texas.
http://forum.nanfa.o...natum-in-texas/

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#4 Guest_mnemenoi_*

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Posted 02 March 2013 - 08:10 PM

I had considered them as an option (I've kept them a few times in the past and they are everywhere locally), but my worries would be
A. Notoriously hide constantly, in such a publicly viewed tank they would hide away and no one would realize anything was in it.
B. Very hard to trick it into eating anything not alive. I imagine the staff is not all about keeping microworms and keeping up with cultures. I usually kept mine with a vast colony of Red Cherry shrimp and they would eat the shrimplets, but with ghost shrimp rarely breeding readily and gammarus can be tricky as well, I'd worry about them starving.

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#5 Michael Wolfe

Board of Directors

North Georgia, Oconee River Drainage

Posted 02 March 2013 - 10:19 PM

Livestock - Gammarus, Ghost Shrimp (Paleomontes sp.), Golden Topminnow ( Fundulus chrysotus) 1M/2F, Possibly a Banded pygmy perch (unsure about adding it as they are difficult to feed), Ramshorn snails (if they get too far out of control I can add some assassins and just remove them at a later time), Tadpole Madtom (if I can find one)

What do you mean "Banded pygmy perch"? Do you mean Enneacanthus or Ellasoma? I would actually be concerned about either one being bullied by the male chysotus in the long run. And I am not sure you would ever see the madtom? To you other point about it being a display tank, the topminnows are a great choice, madtoms, maybe not. What about a small, hardy notropis instead? Not sure what would be in the drainage, but might be a better choice just because they add motion.

And yes, I think with a deep substrate and live plants, you can make this work.

Either write something worth reading or do something worth writing. - Benjamin Franklin

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#6 Guest_mnemenoi_*

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Posted 02 March 2013 - 10:30 PM

Thanks Micheal! The Ellasoma was what I was referring to. I have actually caught some Texas shiners at a nearby creek, but had never considered their addition before. Do you think a 20 gallon would be enough space for a few? I think the madtom was wishful thinking either way, as I have never caught them in any of the nearby drainages (far closer to San Antonio to be exact). I do catch quite a bit locally, but most would not be the best tankmates or need a larger set up. Blackstripe Topminnow, various perch, Pirate Perch, Chain Pickerel, Gambusia, Sailfin Mollies, ect. I might try and collect some Heterandia Formosa as I travel through La. quite frequently and they would be a prefect fir for such a tiny tank. I am meeting the director of the facility in a few weeks and wanted to have a solid plan in mind. I'll try and see about a larger tank as it will allow a wider species range and more inhabitants.

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#7 Guest_decal_*

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Posted 03 March 2013 - 01:26 PM

Madtoms are pretty common around here. I've found a lot of them in Sugar Land (Oyster Creek, Bullhead Slough), in the various creeks in Sam Houston National Forest, up around Lake Sommerville, etc. Kick rocks in creeks, scoop algae/plants and look carefully. I have found lots of madtom fry not even half inch long, still clearly recognizable.

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#8 Guest_mnemenoi_*

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Posted 03 March 2013 - 01:31 PM

Thanks! I'll keep an eye out for them if I end up on that side of town. Think we might be planning a trip to Stafford in a few weeks to pick up some rock for an upgrade to out Tanganyikan tank.

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#9 Guest_gerald_*

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Posted 03 March 2013 - 03:54 PM

Skip the Purigen, keep the tannins. This tank is meant to be educational, not an office lobby decoration, right?
I would do a mix of small slack-water minnow, darter and killie species, and maybe ONE sunfish, a bantam or orangespot.
There are no Enneacanthus native in TX.

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#10 Guest_mnemenoi_*

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Posted 03 March 2013 - 05:02 PM

I have done a 55 gallon checkerboard cichlid biotope and ditched the purigen, but I eventually had to add it to see in the tank. I'd be worried about it getting too dark to see and restrict the T5 lighting for the plants.
I had meant to say Ellasoma Zonatum, the Banded Pygmy Sunfish. They are terrific looking in nice desnely planted nanos I have kept, but are hard to see and can get shy with large groups of kids pointing at the tank and are tough to feed. Mine only survived via shrimplets from a vast RCS population.

How are darters in a low flow tank like this? The only darters I have caught locally are Percina Sciera (Dusky Darter) and they are in much higher flow / sand areas.

I'd love to convince them into 2 setups or even one larger one as it would dramatically increase the livestock and options.

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#11 Guest_rjmtx_*

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Posted 03 March 2013 - 05:59 PM

You'll catch dusky darters in slack water out there, too, and they'll do fine. Bluntnose and slough darters are common around you, and you can also find bigscale logperch, all of which would do fine in a slackwater tank. If you go a little further east, you can also find harlequins, which are very cool looking. I'd also recommend golden or wester starhead topminnows. Sheepshead minnows are also great aquarium specimens.

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#12 Guest_mnemenoi_*

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Posted 03 March 2013 - 06:31 PM

Thanks! I think the Golden Topminnow will be the focus of the tank and with the few I have kept in the past, I think a trio (1M/2F) will work out best in a 20 gallon and not predate too heavily upon the other critters in the tank. The chances of breeding will be good and it should not overly tax the bioload of the tank. Once I speak with the director of the place I'll have a far better handle on what they can manage as far as water changes, dosing, feeding, ect. From speaking to another biologist there, she implied that no one there had any aquarium experiance. With a staf of 3-4 college educated folks, I imagine they should be able to follow a rough schedule and it will be far more maintained then I am imagining. I think it was just a bit intimidating without some first hand knowledge and after I guide them through set up and explaining the reasons and cycles they will be off to the races and might even opt for some additional tanks. I am trying to make it low maintanance to ease them into the idea and allow them to see a fairly self sufficient tank. Lowering the bioload, using dense plants that look good and have what they need make for easy care tanks and are a joy to look at and maintain.

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#13 Guest_Skipjack_*

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Posted 03 March 2013 - 06:50 PM

Go with a bigger tank. More possibilities, and more stable. 75's are fairly cheap on craigslist.

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#14 Guest_mnemenoi_*

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Posted 03 March 2013 - 07:23 PM

Indeed! I think they are wanting a smaller footprint due to space and concerns about upkeep. Once I can get this one running I have a feeling they would be willing to do a bigger project in the future. I have some big tanks at my place and far too many tiny planted nanos, so I am happy working in either size spectrum.

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#15 Michael Wolfe

Board of Directors

North Georgia, Oconee River Drainage

Posted 03 March 2013 - 11:30 PM

I think yes. You could have three top minnows and three or four of a small notropis type shiners. This would be an easy group to feed.

Either write something worth reading or do something worth writing. - Benjamin Franklin

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#16 Guest_mnemenoi_*

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Posted 04 March 2013 - 07:47 AM

Thanks! I think that would work out well and give some additional action to the tank. That was a terrific idea and glad you mentioned them. They are a cool subspecies as well and will help showcase how our local species are unique (even if only in our state).

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#17 Guest_decal_*

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Posted 04 March 2013 - 01:52 PM

I think a bantam would do real well in this setup. They're the smallest, most peaceful sunfish we've got. When they get full grown they'll eat small fish, but outside of the Elassoma and Heterandria everything you've listed would work fine. I've found that non-enthusiasts typically appreciate larger fish more. They're easy to find at Lake Sheldon.

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#18 Guest_mnemenoi_*

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Posted 04 March 2013 - 03:29 PM

I'll keep an eye out for them as it would be great to have one fish that is a bit larger then the rest and something many folks could relate to seeing (or at least saying it was a bluegill/perch/sunfish) they caught while fishing. Thanks for the insight into the Bantams, I have seen them mentioned before, but never kept one myself and you certainly do a great job selling them. I think after the pygmies, I wrote off most of the rest due to tank size requirements...