Javascript Disabled Detected

You currently have javascript disabled. Several functions may not work. Please re-enable javascript to access full functionality.

New Jersey Pine Barrens - 09/07/13

Started by Guest_HicksFish_* , Sep 10 2013 03:26 PM

Next

Reply to this topic

38 replies to this topic

#1 Guest_HicksFish_*

Guests

Posted 10 September 2013 - 03:26 PM

Date: 09/07/2013 (note - this is my first attempt at a trip report, thanks in advance for your patience)...

1st Location: Bunker Hill Bogs, Jackson, NJ
Sampling methods: dip nets, 4x10 seine
Abundant Species: Bluegill sunfish (many juveniles), Eels (many juveniles),
Blackbanded sunfish, Swamp darters
Other Fish: Tadpole Madtom, Pirate Perch, Mud sunfish, Banded sunfish
Other: parasitic wasp, leech, tadpoles, garter snake, frog

2nd Location: Horicon Lake, Lakehurst, NJ
Abundant Species: Bluespotted, Banded and Blackbanded sunfish, Mud sunfish, Pirate perch (many juviniles),
Other fish: Bullhead catfish, Creek chubsuckers, Bluegill sunfish, Chain pickerel
Other: Musk turtle (several juviniles)

3rd Location: Cattus Island Park, Ocean County, NJ
Fish Species: Mummichog, Naked Goby, Banded Killifish, Silversides, Sheepshead minnow
Other: Jellyfish, Crab (blue?), Ghost shrimp
(all were abundant)

Photos: Bunker Hill Bogs
1. NANFA members Mike (keepnatives) and Josh (FirstChaos) showing one of our NJAS newcomers some dipnet techniques. The water here is very tannic, tea colored soft and acidic.

2. on the way in from the parking area, we encountered a parasitic wasp carrying a caterpiller..

3. Mud sunfish (editted)

Photos: Horicon Lake
1. This is a small lake in a built-up residential area. Over the winter, the water level was lowered and much of the aquatic vegetation was removed. When we sampled in the spring, we found almost no floating plants and very few fish other that lots of juvenile pickerel. Now, there's still much less plant material than usual, but the fish seem to be recovering ok. Again, the water here is very tannic.

2. Junenile pickerel (chain pickerel)

3. Blackbanded sunfish

4. Creek chubsucker

#2 Michael Wolfe

Board of Directors

North Georgia, Oconee River Drainage

Posted 10 September 2013 - 04:30 PM

Nice report Bob. You got some very interesting stuff there. Always interesting to see what other regions are seeing out there.

Either write something worth reading or do something worth writing. - Benjamin Franklin

#3 Guest_Kanus_*

Guests

Posted 10 September 2013 - 08:22 PM

Very nice! Thanks for sharing! Pretty special place if you can find blackbandeds, bandeds, and bluespots living together.

#4 Guest_blakemarkwell_*

Guests

Posted 10 September 2013 - 08:49 PM

Man, mud sunfish are too cool -- that's one centrarchid I want to see really bad. Thanks for posting.

#5 Guest_BenCantrell_*

Guests

Posted 10 September 2013 - 09:11 PM

Awesome, thanks for sharing!

#6 mattknepley

NANFA Member

Smack-dab between the Savannah and the Saluda.

Posted 11 September 2013 - 05:17 AM

Those blackbandeds are neat-looking little sunfish. Never seen one in person, just in books. And now on the forum. Gotta say,seeing them in a group, fresh outta the water, the little dudes look like they have individual personalities. Do they, or are they pretty generic in behaviors? Speaking of personalities, that mud sunfish looks like he's got one of the "Leroy Brown" persuasion. He better just not hustle "Willie McCoy/Slim" pictured two spots below him! :biggrin:

Thanks for posting this!

Matt Knepley
"No thanks, a third of a gopher would merely arouse my appetite..."

#7 Guest_Dustin_*

Guests

Posted 11 September 2013 - 07:41 AM

Matt, I will make sure you see some blackbanded sunfish this year. When we see them, we see lots of them. I do think they have the most personality of the Enneacanthus.

#8 Guest_HicksFish_*

Guests

Posted 11 September 2013 - 08:38 AM

Man, mud sunfish are too cool -- that's one centrarchid I want to see really bad. Thanks for posting.

I was surprised at the high number of both Mud sunfish and Pirate perch we saw on this trip. On past trips, we would generally only see one or two (if any), but they would be larger. This trip we saw lots, but they were smaller - maybe sub-adult. My guess is that the difference is from the sampling technique. Josh (FirstChaos) and Mike (keepnatives) were working the banks pretty well using their "Perfect dipnets" with the square shape and fairly shallow nets. I've got to get one of those! The dip net we usually use is round in shape and the netting is very deep.

#9 Guest_HicksFish_*

Guests

Posted 11 September 2013 - 09:12 AM

Those blackbandeds are neat-looking little sunfish. Never seen one in person, just in books. And now on the forum. Gotta say,seeing them in a group, fresh outta the water, the little dudes look like they have individual personalities. Do they, or are they pretty generic in behaviors? ...

I understand that they're very outgoing in the aquarium. I've noticed them checking things out and even eating little critters in the observation / photo tank. When we were sampling Horicon Lake earlier this spring, we were chatting with a gentleman that grew up there as a kid. He was telling us that years ago a fellow from England would come in every summer and pay the local kids to collect blackbanded sunfish for export back to Europe.

#10 Guest_njJohn_*

Guests

Posted 11 September 2013 - 09:20 AM

You can watch black bandeds on youtube. Cool little fish.
and....no eastern mudminows?

#11 Guest_gerald_*

Guests

Posted 11 September 2013 - 09:26 AM

Mud sunfish in aquaria are rather oscar-like in behavior, always watching what's going on in the room and begging for food; never hiding. It doesn't seem to fit at all with their behavior in nature - usually under root mats, branches and leaf litter.

I wonder what's special about Horicon that allows all three Enneacanthus to be co-abundant? In most other places that I've seen Enneacanthus, only one or two species are present, and if there's three, one or two are rare.

#12 Guest_dsuperman_*

Guests

Posted 12 September 2013 - 08:36 AM

Thank you Ray and Bob for having me and my son along,it was just a great day all around.

Denis

#13 Guest_HicksFish_*

Guests

Posted 12 September 2013 - 10:50 AM

It was our pleasure Denis - it really was a great group and a great day.

#14 Guest_HicksFish_*

Guests

Posted 12 September 2013 - 10:55 AM

... I wonder what's special about Horicon that allows all three Enneacanthus to be co-abundant? In most other places that I've seen Enneacanthus, only one or two species are present, and if there's three, one or two are rare.

Thanks for the mission Gerald! I'd like to continue to try to sample Horicon a couple of times a year, and report back here. Maybe something we see will suggest an explanation.
I was told by the NJ Fish and Wildlife non-gamefish biologist that he believes the Bluespotted and Banded sunfish will hybridize. I'm curious if anyone here has any thoughts on that?

#15 Guest_gerald_*

Guests

Posted 12 September 2013 - 11:35 AM

Well, there's your mission #2: Around Feb-Mar go collect a bunch of ready-to-spawn obesus and gloriosus, set up several tubs each with a mixed pair (using only fish whose ID is unquestionable), a dish of sand and dense plants, and see what happens. There are certainly some fish that look intermediate between the two (see discussion in Jenkins & Burkhead's Virginia Fishes, page 717), but I'm not aware of any genetic investigation to prove it. Hybridization sure makes a convenient excuse for specimens that we're not sure about. Museum folks working from old preserved fish have a harder time -- to me, live ones are usually not hard to distinguish based on color and head shape (although you saw me waffling in 2012, before I learned that NJ obesus can have an orange anal fin). My guess is that hybrids might happen on occasion when a female can't find a territory-holding male of her own species (IF they are even genetically compatible), but most of the time behavioral cues keep them separate.

#16 Guest_davidjh2_*

Guests

Posted 13 September 2013 - 11:06 AM

I think I'll have to come along for the next trip. I don't need anything for my tanks and my water is way too hard to boot but hanging just catching fish is fun.

#17 Guest_HicksFish_*

Guests

Posted 13 September 2013 - 11:26 AM

Well, there's your mission #2: ... obesus and gloriosus ... (IF they are even genetically compatible), ...

Thanks again Gerald! Between now and next spring I'm going to do some more reading and give serious thought to giving this a try. I have had some (accidental) success with obesus spawning in a 110g outdoor tub with lots of plants, algae and driftwood. I'm thinking along the lines of 2 of these set up as you described and 2 others as single species controls...

#18 Guest_HicksFish_*

Guests

Posted 13 September 2013 - 11:39 AM

I think I'll have to come along for the next trip. I don't need anything for my tanks and my water is way too hard to boot but hanging just catching fish is fun.

It would be great to have you join us again David! Sorry, no crayfish this time - but I have seen one (and only one) in Horicon Lake.
This trip we also sampled a brackish water area at Cattus Island park which was a first for me. It was really interesting and not that far away so I'm sure we'll be heading back there. I understand from Mike and Ray that several of those species can be acclimated to fresh water.

#19 Guest_gerald_*

Guests

Posted 13 September 2013 - 02:06 PM

Try it both ways in different tubs: male obesus x female gloriosus, and female obesus x male gloriosus. With some animals they can be genetically compatible one way but not the other. With just 4 tubs, you might want to use them all for hybrid testing. The "controls" wont really tell you much in this case. And then of course, there's the question of hybrid fertility ... with each other, or back-crossed with either parent species.

Thanks again Gerald! Between now and next spring I'm going to do some more reading and give serious thought to giving this a try. I have had some (accidental) success with obesus spawning in a 110g outdoor tub with lots of plants, algae and driftwood. I'm thinking along the lines of 2 of these set up as you described and 2 others as single species controls...

#20 Guest_HicksFish_*

Guests

Posted 13 September 2013 - 03:31 PM

I was thinking of the controls just to make sure the settings were conducive for the fish to spawn (since I've only managed to get up to 65 BAP points in my local aquarium club). May need to go with 6 tubs...