As part of my application for a SC scientific collection permit I had to agree to submit data to the state DNR concerning the fish I found swimming in various waterways. I stumbled across the NANFA scientific collection data sheet, and have used it as often as any of my other sophisticated collected data retrieval systems, namely scratch pieces of paper and fastfood napkins. Not that I've used it properly; I've pretty much just jotted down stuff on it. I've got a year's worth of scratch paper, napkins, and data sheets.
I am now getting ready to collate my hodge-podge of notes into information to submit to the state. Looking more closely at our collection data sheet, I have some questions. If these questions are as dumb as I am afraid they are, just bear with me...
Firstly, the very top of the sheet has spaces for detailing the location of where the sampling was done. They are ordered on the sheet thusly; Location, Tributary Of, Drainage Division, River System. The intent appears to be to go from most specific to broadest location identity. If my impression is correct, shouldn't River System be before Drainage Division? Wouldn't that be the way to order things? Or is that the proper ordering from most specific to broadest and I need to reteach myself drainage terminology? Or does it not really matter as people with more experience than I will understand the form's intent? I'm not trying to be nit-picky, but I'd like to do this as professionally as a noob could be expected to do.
Secondly, when filling out the species column, should I use common name, scientific name, or both? What are the guidelines for filling in the abundance column? Does it vary by species? Do I use actual numbers, such as the greatest number of any species I had in hand at one time? Or can I use estimates for large schools? What about "probables", as in "this fish is probably a redbreast sunfish, but..."? Do we just use the genus (Lepomis sp.)?
Thirdly, in the habitat-describing part of the form, does length of stream refer to total length of the stream, or the length of stream sampled? Is "length of stream" synonymous with "length of shoreline" if discussing a standing body of water? For the dominant substrate, turbidity, dominant instream cover, and water level sections, is it acceptable to choose more than one answer choice, or should I just pick one? For example, a couple streams I like could be argued to have a dominant substrate of gravel AND sand. They also have equal amounts of downed trees and large rock for cover...
Thanks for reading this far into this. I'm sure I've made a mountain out of a chub's nest, but that's what I do...
Using the NANFA Collection Data Sheet
Started by
mattknepley
, Nov 06 2013 08:27 PM
12 replies to this topic
#2
Michael Wolfe
-
- Board of Directors
-
- North Georgia, Oconee River Drainage
Posted 06 November 2013 - 09:25 PM
One man's opinion on your questions...
On your first question, I think that tribs can be pretty small... and then you and I were in the Stevens River Drainage... but then obviously in the Savannah River System... see this map:
http://www.dnr.sc.go.../river/map.html
Always use scientific names... and for abundance I have used things like actual numbers up to about a dozen or so... and then go to something like "abundant" (like when you get a whole seine full of C. leedsi at the type locality... there was no way to count 40 plus shiners in the seine and the 40 plus that were swimming around the seine laughing at us).
not sure about that third part... be descriptive?!?
On your first question, I think that tribs can be pretty small... and then you and I were in the Stevens River Drainage... but then obviously in the Savannah River System... see this map:
http://www.dnr.sc.go.../river/map.html
Always use scientific names... and for abundance I have used things like actual numbers up to about a dozen or so... and then go to something like "abundant" (like when you get a whole seine full of C. leedsi at the type locality... there was no way to count 40 plus shiners in the seine and the 40 plus that were swimming around the seine laughing at us).
not sure about that third part... be descriptive?!?
Either write something worth reading or do something worth writing. - Benjamin Franklin
#6
Guest_Doug_Dame_*
Guest_Doug_Dame_*
-
- Guests
Posted 07 November 2013 - 01:12 AM
When I fill out the NANFA collection form, which I confess I do not do all the time, I try to list the species by frequency. But that's just for my personal use. (Disclaimer: amateur.)
Counts are caught, not observed, unless it's a snorkel tour. Will generally note any additional species observed. And usually expected species not encountered, so the lack can be traced to not catching them, rather than not identifying them. Exact counts up to 10 (as I can remember them), ranges for larger numbers.
There are no hard & fast rules on what to record. Otherwise there would be no NANFA collections form, we'd all be using David Star Jordan's design, or somebody else's. But the methods used (e.g., seine vs dipnet), manpower, and wet-foot-time should always be recorded IMO, that potentially allows your collection data to be combined with other data on a yield/effort basis, to provide some insights into biodiversity across a region or for a particular site over time. Four people seining for 2 hours will get a more complete sample than one guy with a dip net in 30 minutes. Names of participants are important too, it helps validate the quality of the effort and the probable accuracy of species IDs.
Clearly, the date/time and exact location is also critical for this kind of use. Use a GPS to get the long/lat, or get it from Google Maps after you're home. For my own use, I make sure I have the DeLorme Gazatteer map page, grid reference, and a text description. (Mocassin Creek at CR-472.)
For species ID, I'll use "(prob)", "(poss)" or "unkn shiner" with notes on any possible identifying marks. (Photos are better, of course.)
Obviously if you are compiling and submitting collection sheets in connection with a scientific collecting permit, the kind of information you record should be consistent with whatever purpose you stated when you applied for the permit. It would probably be also important to document how much and what kinds of specimens you kept vs those that were released alive back into their habitat. The renewal of the scientific permit may be influenced by the cost of your environmental impact, especially on uncommon species, vs the potential value of your contribution to science. Never sanitize the data, truth is sacred in science, and all field work has warts. Any necessary corrections should be made with neat cross-outs that allow the original words or numbers to be read.
I would not re-record batches of NANFA forms just to make them pretty and consistent. That would be indistinguishable from what the DNR would get if you sat at your desk one afternoon and just made everything up, because you'd suddenly remembered you were supposed to be recording all this stuff, and hadn't been. But copying info from napkins etc would be okay, just record the original collection date and annotate the form somewhere as "copied from original napkin, dd-mmm-yy". (When science is involved, I was trained as an undergrad to always record dates as the unambiguous 06-Jul-2013, rather than 7/6/13. And to cross my sevens so they are clearly not ones. And fours have open tops so they don't look like nines. And eights are formed as a circle on top of a circle, not as a figure-of-eight, because if you did it the wrong way the professor would drop your work from an 'A' to a 'B'. Or 'C' to 'D'.)
I keep thinking I need a voice recorder to capture more notes on-site, but I haven't found one that's waterproof and affordable. If anyone has any suggestions, I'm all ears.
HTH
Counts are caught, not observed, unless it's a snorkel tour. Will generally note any additional species observed. And usually expected species not encountered, so the lack can be traced to not catching them, rather than not identifying them. Exact counts up to 10 (as I can remember them), ranges for larger numbers.
There are no hard & fast rules on what to record. Otherwise there would be no NANFA collections form, we'd all be using David Star Jordan's design, or somebody else's. But the methods used (e.g., seine vs dipnet), manpower, and wet-foot-time should always be recorded IMO, that potentially allows your collection data to be combined with other data on a yield/effort basis, to provide some insights into biodiversity across a region or for a particular site over time. Four people seining for 2 hours will get a more complete sample than one guy with a dip net in 30 minutes. Names of participants are important too, it helps validate the quality of the effort and the probable accuracy of species IDs.
Clearly, the date/time and exact location is also critical for this kind of use. Use a GPS to get the long/lat, or get it from Google Maps after you're home. For my own use, I make sure I have the DeLorme Gazatteer map page, grid reference, and a text description. (Mocassin Creek at CR-472.)
For species ID, I'll use "(prob)", "(poss)" or "unkn shiner" with notes on any possible identifying marks. (Photos are better, of course.)
Obviously if you are compiling and submitting collection sheets in connection with a scientific collecting permit, the kind of information you record should be consistent with whatever purpose you stated when you applied for the permit. It would probably be also important to document how much and what kinds of specimens you kept vs those that were released alive back into their habitat. The renewal of the scientific permit may be influenced by the cost of your environmental impact, especially on uncommon species, vs the potential value of your contribution to science. Never sanitize the data, truth is sacred in science, and all field work has warts. Any necessary corrections should be made with neat cross-outs that allow the original words or numbers to be read.
I would not re-record batches of NANFA forms just to make them pretty and consistent. That would be indistinguishable from what the DNR would get if you sat at your desk one afternoon and just made everything up, because you'd suddenly remembered you were supposed to be recording all this stuff, and hadn't been. But copying info from napkins etc would be okay, just record the original collection date and annotate the form somewhere as "copied from original napkin, dd-mmm-yy". (When science is involved, I was trained as an undergrad to always record dates as the unambiguous 06-Jul-2013, rather than 7/6/13. And to cross my sevens so they are clearly not ones. And fours have open tops so they don't look like nines. And eights are formed as a circle on top of a circle, not as a figure-of-eight, because if you did it the wrong way the professor would drop your work from an 'A' to a 'B'. Or 'C' to 'D'.)
I keep thinking I need a voice recorder to capture more notes on-site, but I haven't found one that's waterproof and affordable. If anyone has any suggestions, I'm all ears.
HTH
#7
mattknepley
-
- NANFA Member
- Smack-dab between the Savannah and the Saluda.
Posted 07 November 2013 - 07:00 AM
Thanks, guys. I feel like I have a little better grasp on what I'm doing here. Still a little shaky on the whole drainage/system thing, though. Not sure that messing it up would be an egregious error, however. Obviously dnr would know my intent.
Thanks for the link to the map, Michael. I have never been able to get it to open up full size until you put it on your reply. A "humility increaser", I suppose. It definitely is a help in identifying boundaries of different drainages. For the record, I can't imagine any leedsi having the audacity to laugh at you. They must have been laughing at the ones who got caught!
Matt, I hadn't ever thought about putting them in phylogenetic order. I like that idea.
Doug, I see what you are saying about submitting original sheets, not prettified recreations. For clarity's sake though, I'm going to need to do some transcribing. Would attaching the original to the prettied-up one be ok, in your opinion? Also, I think your prof and my high school geometry teacher were one and the same. Except I also had to cross my "z"s because they look just like my "2"s. Genealogical efforts got me using the dd/mm/yr model and that's what I used on the form. Maybe I'll start using military time on it, too. My location description may not be bang-on, but you'll sure as heck know when I was there!
Thanks for the link to the map, Michael. I have never been able to get it to open up full size until you put it on your reply. A "humility increaser", I suppose. It definitely is a help in identifying boundaries of different drainages. For the record, I can't imagine any leedsi having the audacity to laugh at you. They must have been laughing at the ones who got caught!
Matt, I hadn't ever thought about putting them in phylogenetic order. I like that idea.
Doug, I see what you are saying about submitting original sheets, not prettified recreations. For clarity's sake though, I'm going to need to do some transcribing. Would attaching the original to the prettied-up one be ok, in your opinion? Also, I think your prof and my high school geometry teacher were one and the same. Except I also had to cross my "z"s because they look just like my "2"s. Genealogical efforts got me using the dd/mm/yr model and that's what I used on the form. Maybe I'll start using military time on it, too. My location description may not be bang-on, but you'll sure as heck know when I was there!
Matt Knepley
"No thanks, a third of a gopher would merely arouse my appetite..."
"No thanks, a third of a gopher would merely arouse my appetite..."
#9
Michael Wolfe
-
- Board of Directors
-
- North Georgia, Oconee River Drainage
Posted 07 November 2013 - 02:41 PM
Either write something worth reading or do something worth writing. - Benjamin Franklin
#10
Guest_smbass_*
Guest_smbass_*
-
- Guests
Posted 24 December 2013 - 05:29 PM
Excuse the bringing up of an old topic but I figured someone who collects fish for my job may be useful to weigh in here. Unfortunately I rarely have time to look around, read and participate on here any more. The Holidays have given me the rare chance to do so... The NANFA collection sheet works great as a sheet to print out and carry copies with you as a quick field note documentation. However any state agency looking to use the data would probably store the data in a database of one form or another. Using an excel spread sheet to store field collection data will translate into a database much easier than a single page sheet for each trip. This format allows you to store thousands of trips on a single excel page on your computer. Also if your column headings are at least similar or the same as the database an agency is storing the data in it will be much easier for them to enter your data (and more likely they actually take the time to enter your data). Three years ago I took about 7 years worth of personal collections that had been stored in various word file (single page formats) and combined them all into one master file that translates very easily into our on-line database. This task was well worth my effort. Now with a couple of simple clicks I can sort my life's worth of collecting records by species or location or what ever information I have stored in the past that I would like to recall. I will quickly go over how I set mine up, this is by no means the exact way it should be done but just an example... You want to make a column for each thing that could pertain to a collection, I start mine with all of the species information and then go into locality info and finish with the date and other field data like habitat comments and so on.
So my columns are... Common Name, an arbitrary taxonomical ordering # (so lampreys are 1 and most advanced groups like perch, gobbies have the highest number). My system goes 1 through 22. This really is just for sorting purposes and you can devise what ever system makes sense to you. Next I have Order, then Family, then Genus, then Species, then Subspecies. Then I have Number captured and number kept along with a column for what we did with the kept fish (preserved in formalin, made into a skeleton, or stored in alcohol for DNA analysis) If you are not preserving fish this is probably unnecessary info. Then I go into the locality info. You can set this up a lot of ways but the one most important item is the latitude longitude coordinates. Nearly everything else about a location can be generated by someone with some computer skills in a GIS program later on very easily if you have good coordinates for the location. That being said this is how I store things... Continent, Country, State, County, Water body, Written description of site (like at SR 53), then a distance to nearest town (5 miles south of Greentown OH), then township, and then the all important lat and then long coordinates. Next I have columns for date (this is also very important), then a field number (this gives you a way to sort and keep all species caught at a particular site and date together) I use my initials and the date with a letter at the end to help keep them in order if I make multiple samples on the same day so an example would be BJZ2013MAY18A for the first stop I took on the 18th of may in 2013. Next I have a column for collectors so the names of those involved can be listed out, then one for collecting method (seine, dip net, cast net, hooka and line, visual observation while snorkeling), one for effort (how long we spent sampling or how much distance of the stream we covered, habitat notes, and lastly one for other comments as a catch all.
This may sound very complicated but it really is not too bad once you see it. I will attach a file as an example of a few lines of data and how this could work. I'm sure others use similar sheets and have other items they store. I just wanted to give an example of a way to make field data go smoothly into a database. If stored in a different sheet for each trip field data is very time consuming to enter into a database at an agency. If all NANFA members saved data in a format like this we as a group could develop a very impressive data set for North American fish distributions.
So my columns are... Common Name, an arbitrary taxonomical ordering # (so lampreys are 1 and most advanced groups like perch, gobbies have the highest number). My system goes 1 through 22. This really is just for sorting purposes and you can devise what ever system makes sense to you. Next I have Order, then Family, then Genus, then Species, then Subspecies. Then I have Number captured and number kept along with a column for what we did with the kept fish (preserved in formalin, made into a skeleton, or stored in alcohol for DNA analysis) If you are not preserving fish this is probably unnecessary info. Then I go into the locality info. You can set this up a lot of ways but the one most important item is the latitude longitude coordinates. Nearly everything else about a location can be generated by someone with some computer skills in a GIS program later on very easily if you have good coordinates for the location. That being said this is how I store things... Continent, Country, State, County, Water body, Written description of site (like at SR 53), then a distance to nearest town (5 miles south of Greentown OH), then township, and then the all important lat and then long coordinates. Next I have columns for date (this is also very important), then a field number (this gives you a way to sort and keep all species caught at a particular site and date together) I use my initials and the date with a letter at the end to help keep them in order if I make multiple samples on the same day so an example would be BJZ2013MAY18A for the first stop I took on the 18th of may in 2013. Next I have a column for collectors so the names of those involved can be listed out, then one for collecting method (seine, dip net, cast net, hooka and line, visual observation while snorkeling), one for effort (how long we spent sampling or how much distance of the stream we covered, habitat notes, and lastly one for other comments as a catch all.
This may sound very complicated but it really is not too bad once you see it. I will attach a file as an example of a few lines of data and how this could work. I'm sure others use similar sheets and have other items they store. I just wanted to give an example of a way to make field data go smoothly into a database. If stored in a different sheet for each trip field data is very time consuming to enter into a database at an agency. If all NANFA members saved data in a format like this we as a group could develop a very impressive data set for North American fish distributions.
#12
Guest_smbass_*
Guest_smbass_*
-
- Guests
Posted 24 December 2013 - 11:08 PM
I'd be happy to let NANFA use my format, we could probably take out the columns for what was kept and how it was preserved for the Museum collection but the rest of it could be used for typical collecting trips. For some reason I can't seem to get my example set to attach... I'd also be happy to hear any suggestions that anyone else may have about improvements that could be made.
#13
Guest_AussiePeter_*
Guest_AussiePeter_*
-
- Guests
Posted 25 December 2013 - 01:25 AM
Brian's site code is a bit long for me. I just use my initials, the year, then a number to represent each collection. Currently I'm at PU13-89. Short and simply for labels that I use for everything associated with that collection.
Order of the drainages doesn't really matter. That's just the way I originally did it, which was pretty random.
Cheers
Peter
Order of the drainages doesn't really matter. That's just the way I originally did it, which was pretty random.
Cheers
Peter
Reply to this topic
0 user(s) are reading this topic
0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users
NANFA Youtube Channel 
