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Florida saltwater ID's


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#1 Guest_FishyJackson_*

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Posted 14 October 2014 - 12:53 PM

Was up to the old antics down in Sarasota in the Mangrove Ecosystem. I got a bunch of fish for IDs here

1) This first pic is from Mote Aquarium, is the fish on the left a Swordspine Snook?

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2) This next one may not be solvable, I wasn't able to catch it or get good footage of it, but If you check out the link to the 7 second youtube video below, the fish can be seen towards the middle/right middle of the screen. It's body shape is like a Killifish, it was dark/black but seemed to have light blotches, it's head was whitish. I saw one of these fish the last time I was down here, each time it was solitary unlike the rest of the fish there in the Mangroves. It was nibbling at the coral/rocks, and had no interest in the little piece of squid I was trying to catch it on.




3) I caught one of these Gobies before and it was believed to be a Frillfin Goby, but that was with a lousy picture. I caught a few this time and got a better pic. These Gobies are really interesting little creatures, they are more common than I thought, there were a ton of them back there. I think these are Frillfin but want to confirm.

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4) Sheepshead Minnow?

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#2 Guest_FishyJackson_*

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Posted 14 October 2014 - 12:56 PM

5) Is this a baby Stingray or a Skate? And what species? I thought it was a baby Stingray and was being careful of the tail when unhooking it, then a guy walked by and said it was a Skate. I was about to just grab it by the tail but then I noticed what may have been a barb.

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#3 Guest_FishyJackson_*

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Posted 14 October 2014 - 01:14 PM

6) I have a couple more mojarra questions for the experts. When I caught the small Mojarra last time I thought it was a rare encounter there and got it ID'd as a Silver Jenny. Turns out there are tons of these things back there haha, but for some reason I never see any adults. I'm assuming they're mostly Silver Jennies I'm catching, I know about the Mojarra Key and that the head is how to tell the difference, but I can't seem to ever tell when I look at the top of the head. Is the below pic of the top of the head of this fish good enough for any of you guys to ID this? And in the 2nd pic, I was wondering if at a slightly bigger size like this one if you can tell just by looking at it or if you would still require looking at the top of the head?

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#4 Guest_Kanus_*

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Posted 15 October 2014 - 07:25 AM

I think number 4 may be Floridicthys carpio. Can't help you much past that unfortunately.

#5 Guest_zooxanthellae_*

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Posted 15 October 2014 - 10:35 AM

I think number 4 may be Floridicthys carpio. Can't help you much past that unfortunately.


#1. I have never actually seen a swordspine, but from the descriptions the second anal spine should be longer than any anal rays. It doesn't appear that way from the photo, so I'm not sure.
#2. I dont actually see any fish in that video, sorry.
#3. This looks an awful lot like a frillfin to me, and the counts are correct, but I am not seeing any free pectoral rays (which lend the frilfin its name). Did you see any when you caught it?
#4. I was thinking the same thing as Kanus here. It is at least worth looking into as a possibility.
#5. This is definitely a stingray, and at first glance I would say an Atlantic Stingray, Dasyatis sabina.
#6. I can't help you here, you were right to photograph the head, as the identification can hinge on scale counts and arrangements on the head. Unfortunately I can't make out any of the scales in your photograph! Do you have any others?

#6 Guest_FishyJackson_*

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Posted 15 October 2014 - 01:09 PM

Thanks for replies guys, just disregard ID #2 (the video) For some reason it's a little more clear on my phone than on youtube. This fish baffles me, but I think I may encounter him again next time I'm down there because I've seen him multiple trips now. I'm going to bring a slurp gun next time and try to get him that way.

#4- Goldspotted Killifish- That looks like a strong possibility, I have a slight better pic on my phone that I will crop and upload later and maybe we can confirm it. There just arent obvious gold spots in my pictures, maybe they had faded out of the water, but after reading a description of that species the dark irregular bands on the lower side seem to match up to my fish.

#5- After checking out pics of juvenile Atlantic Stingrays I am convinced that was exactly what it was. Glad I didnt listen to the guy who felt it necessary to confidently state that it was just a harmless Skate.

#1- I think it's a Tarpon Snook actually, Mote Aquarium was real good about properly labeling all the fish but I'm pretty certain that wasn't a regular Common Snook.

I preserved the Killifish, one of the Gobies and one of the Mojarras. I left them in the freezer down there in the condo in case further investigations are required.

#3- I don't recall if there were any free pectoral rays, but these Gobies seem to dominate the Goby scene in the Mangroves in Sarasota. I caught probably 8 or 10 of them and didnt see any other species. I saw one of those Sarasota PDF files last night that had a bunch of species from a survey sampling of Sarasota Bay (I cant find the file now) and I didnt see Frillfin Goby in it, but that may not mean anything. Maybe Code Goby?


#6- I think it's possible some of them might be Tidewater Mojarras, but these things give me a headache trying to figure them out.

#7 Guest_fritz_*

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Posted 15 October 2014 - 02:54 PM

1 - I can agree with tarpon snook on the left and common in center/right
5 - definitely an Atlantic stingray
6 - to get the scales to be more visible, try and dry them off as much as you can. maybe by blowing on the head. Can't tell anything from head photo
the second, whole body photo doesn't look like a silver jenny and could be a tidewater.

#8 Guest_FishyJackson_*

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Posted 15 October 2014 - 05:49 PM

thanks Fritz, will try to dry it off next time for a better pic

Here is another pic of the possible Goldspotted Killifish, still hard to tell if there are gold spots but I do think you guys are right, does this pic help?

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#9 Guest_associatedboy_*

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Posted 16 October 2014 - 12:48 AM

Both snook are commons, the small snook Mote has on display are some of their aquacultured specimens and they occasionally come out disproportionate looking; these are often the ones they display as they can't be released due to possible deformities etc (I used to work there during high school and undergrad). Can't see a fish in the vid, but may try to take a closer look later. 3 is definitely a frillfin goby (I did my undergraduate thesis on them in Sarasota), and they can indeed at times be almost everywhere. You can find them in tidal creeks that are nearly fresh water in the summer rainy season all the way out to limestone outcroppings on the beaches. 4 is definitely a goldspotted killifish, they can also be quite common and found in the same areas as sheepshead minnows. In my experience you tend to find them near mangroves and shorelines with seagrass nearby (i.e. less tolerant of freshwater environments than sheepshead minnows can be), but I have also occasionally seen them quite far upstream in tidal rivers. 5: I'm not great with sharks and rays, but that looks like an Atlantic sting ray. The head shot of 6 looks like a silver jenny and based on the whole body shot it should definitely be large enough to get a fairly solid ID with the key (doesn't work great for fish less than about 2 or 3 inches), but Eucinostomus mojarras have always been a pain to me. We would often just lump them together in fish surveys down there due to the difficulty of their ID in the field.

#10 Guest_associatedboy_*

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Posted 16 October 2014 - 12:55 AM

Got a better look at the vid and see the fish now, looks like it's probably a melanistic sailfin molly. These are pretty common in certain salt marsh/mangrove swamp areas between Sarasota and Tampa Bay.

#11 Guest_FishyJackson_*

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Posted 16 October 2014 - 09:59 AM

Associated Boy- That has to go down as one of the most legendary fish ID posts in fish ID history. Melanistic Sailfin Molly haha I cant believe you got that one, great work. Thanks a lot for this, and thanks to all others who replied. All fish are 100% ID'd except the mojarra which I guess I'm just going to have to assume are all Silver Jennies, until I catch a bigger one next time.

#12 littlen

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Posted 16 October 2014 - 12:59 PM

I watched the video at least 20 times, and never saw a fish!
Nick L.

#13 Guest_Kanus_*

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Posted 16 October 2014 - 06:57 PM

I saw the fish in like two frames, and paused it and looked. I sorta thought melanistic molly, but wasn't confident enough to mention it. Now that someone else said it, and I'm the only other person to see a fish (I was always really good at those "Magic-Eye" puzzles as a kid), I'll vote for molly also.

#14 Guest_Skipjack_*

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Posted 16 October 2014 - 07:32 PM

I saw it after about 7 views. What it was? It was dark colored.

#15 Guest_associatedboy_*

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Posted 17 October 2014 - 09:34 AM

If you click on the YouTube link on the bottom right of the video to watch it through the YouTube site you can change the video setting and watch a higher quality vid, which makes it much easier to see the fish.

#16 littlen

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Posted 17 October 2014 - 10:39 AM

^ good tip, thanks. I was able to finally see it. I will agree with the other guesses.
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#17 Guest_mzokan_*

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Posted 17 October 2014 - 02:47 PM

I agree that the killi is Floridichthys

The goby is definitely Bathygobius. They split up several of the western Atlantic species, but based on color pattern yours looks like soporator. The free pectoral rays can be hard to see when they are stuck together when out of water.

As for the mojarra, with the whole body photo you can rule out gula because yours is more slender in terms of body depth. The premaxillary pit appears to extend quite far forward and not V-shaped, which rules out argenteus. So its between harengulus and jonesi -- its hard to be certain from the photo, but like Fritz, I'll lean harengulus

#18 Guest_FishyJackson_*

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Posted 17 October 2014 - 05:15 PM

What's up Mzokan, thanks for weighing in. I was all set to just let it be with the Mojarra this time but you have now left me no choice but to get this fish officially ID'd haha. I don't have a better picture of it so I'm going to contact the Fish DNA Test people again and mail it in, assuming I did infact freeze the fish in the picture.

#19 Guest_FishyJackson_*

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 09:48 AM

My mom was down at the condo in Sarasota and I had her take out the Mojarra and put it in some salt to dry it out and then bring it back to NY...a process that she definitely enjoyed doing very much haha. It turned out there were 2 Mojarras in the freezer (was using these little mojarras as bait) but I'm not sure if either of them are the same fish as in the pic in post#3 where Mzokan said Gula can be ruled out.

I want to see if you guys think this is same species as in the pic in post#3 and if you still think it's definitely not Gula. I took a pic of the top of the head but doesn't really seem like it would be too helpful in it's current state with the salt

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#20 Guest_mzokan_*

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Posted 08 November 2014 - 04:21 PM

I don't think E. gula can be ruled out from those two unless you get a good photo of the premaxillary pit. I think it is safe to say the upper one is not the fish in your original photo given the shape and fin color and is probably gula. The second one....don't know




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