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Saluda, NC


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#1 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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  • Pigeon Watershed, North Carolina

Posted 02 September 2016 - 09:05 AM

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#2 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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  • Pigeon Watershed, North Carolina

Posted 02 September 2016 - 09:06 AM

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#3 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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  • Pigeon Watershed, North Carolina

Posted 02 September 2016 - 09:06 AM

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#4 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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Posted 02 September 2016 - 09:06 AM

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#5 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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Posted 02 September 2016 - 09:07 AM

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#6 Dustin

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Posted 02 September 2016 - 09:15 AM

Looks like you found some new species.

 

First two are western blacknose dace and the last few are central stonerollers.


Dustin Smith
At the convergence of the Broad, Saluda and Congaree
Lexington, SC


#7 Josh Blaylock

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  • Central Kentucky

Posted 02 September 2016 - 09:15 AM

Not sure what's in that area, But I thought the 1st looked like a MRBD


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#8 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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  • Pigeon Watershed, North Carolina

Posted 02 September 2016 - 09:25 AM

Looks like you found some new species.

 

First two are western blacknose dace and the last few are central stonerollers.

Ugh, already have those, still looking for the Eastern Blacknose.

 

Thanks for the id's going out again today if the weather is ok.



#9 gerald

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  • Wake Forest, North Carolina

Posted 02 September 2016 - 11:26 AM

Eastern blacknose dace (atratulus) is supposedly in the Roanoke basin and northward.  The New (Kanawha),Yadkin, Santee (Catawba, Broad, Saluda), Savannah, Tennessee, and Gulf drainage populations should all be Western (obtusus) according to recent genetic studies.  Separating them visually is pretty near hopeless; both are quite variable in appearance.  I imagine they'd be very susceptible to "headwater stream capture" between drainage basins, and bait bucket transport in areas where their ranges are close.  I'm guessing Dustin's ID of "western" is based only on location, right?

 

Molecular Phylogenetics of the Eastern and Western Blacknose Dace, Rhinichthys atratulus and R. obtusus (Teleostei: Cyprinidae). Michelle Kraczkowski and Barry Chernoff.  Copeia Jun 2014 : Vol. 2014, Issue 2, pg(s) 325-338 doi: 10.1643/CG-14-002.   http://www.bioone.or....1643/CG-14-002
 

Gerald Pottern
-----------------------
Hangin' on the Neuse
"Taxonomy is the diaper used to organize the mess of evolution into discrete packages" - M.Sandel


#10 Matt DeLaVega

Matt DeLaVega
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  • Ohio

Posted 02 September 2016 - 01:02 PM

Not sure what's in that area, But I thought the 1st looked like a MRBD

You need a good old fashioned whoopin'.


The member formerly known as Skipjack


#11 Dustin

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Posted 03 September 2016 - 09:19 AM

You need a good old fashioned whoopin'.

I'm glad someone else brought this up.  I have to assume Josh was very sleepy, intoxicated or not wearing his glasses...


Dustin Smith
At the convergence of the Broad, Saluda and Congaree
Lexington, SC


#12 Dustin

Dustin
  • Forum Staff

Posted 03 September 2016 - 09:20 AM

 

Eastern blacknose dace (atratulus) is supposedly in the Roanoke basin and northward.  The New (Kanawha),Yadkin, Santee (Catawba, Broad, Saluda), Savannah, Tennessee, and Gulf drainage populations should all be Western (obtusus) according to recent genetic studies.  Separating them visually is pretty near hopeless; both are quite variable in appearance.  I imagine they'd be very susceptible to "headwater stream capture" between drainage basins, and bait bucket transport in areas where their ranges are close.  I'm guessing Dustin's ID of "western" is based only on location, right?

 

Molecular Phylogenetics of the Eastern and Western Blacknose Dace, Rhinichthys atratulus and R. obtusus (Teleostei: Cyprinidae). Michelle Kraczkowski and Barry Chernoff.  Copeia Jun 2014 : Vol. 2014, Issue 2, pg(s) 325-338 doi: 10.1643/CG-14-002.   http://www.bioone.or....1643/CG-14-002
 

 

Completely on location Gerald.  I have no idea what the differences in appearance are, if there even are any.


Dustin Smith
At the convergence of the Broad, Saluda and Congaree
Lexington, SC


#13 fundulus

fundulus
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Posted 03 September 2016 - 10:00 AM

That's a good paper, they thank me at the end for supplying dace from Blue Spring in north 'bama(!!).
Bruce Stallsmith, Huntsville, Alabama, US of A

#14 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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  • Pigeon Watershed, North Carolina

Posted 04 September 2016 - 10:09 AM

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#15 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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  • Pigeon Watershed, North Carolina

Posted 04 September 2016 - 10:11 AM

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#16 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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Posted 04 September 2016 - 10:11 AM

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#17 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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  • Pigeon Watershed, North Carolina

Posted 04 September 2016 - 10:12 AM

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#18 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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  • Pigeon Watershed, North Carolina

Posted 04 September 2016 - 10:12 AM

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#19 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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Posted 04 September 2016 - 10:13 AM

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#20 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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Posted 04 September 2016 - 10:14 AM

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