8 replies to this topic

[FishingDavid1990]

Hello Everyone, 

 

I have been searching the forum for as much information as possible and trying to do my due diligence as far as researching, and I will continue to do so on my own, but I also thought that the best way to gather some information would be to go ahead and make a thread as well. I am incredibly grateful for anyone's input. 

I am familiar with freshwater tropical fish keeping (store bought) but have never kept salt or brackish water fish and have never caught and kept native fish before. But I am very interested in doing so. 

I want to start two different tanks.

In one tank I am hoping to put some Golden Topminnow, Least Killifish, Melanisitic mosquitofish,  and sailfin mollys. Maybe some Bluefin Killifish and some darter species as well. 

In the other tank I am hoping to put some slightly larger and more aggressive species such as Pirate Perch, Dollar Sunfish, Tadpole Madtom, and Fat Sleeper Goby. The idea being that I can feed them small Eastern Mosquitofish from the local ditches. 

I plan to collect substrate from the locations where I collect the fish from. I am not going to treat it or anything (unless someone convinces me too). I have read that other people on here have luck doing exactly that. 

I plan to collect some plants, rocks, and sticks from the locations where I collect the fish from as well. 

No heater, just room temp water. Standard filter system. Treated tap water. 

Feeding - Flakes for the first tank. Small eastern mosquitofish for the second tank. There are plenty of them around here that I can collect. 

Can anyone give me info, or point me in the right direction for what the salinity should be for both tanks? And how do I get it right? 

If there are any issues/red flags with anything that I have said here please set me straight. 

I am excited to get started. 

 

Thanks a bunch for any help! 

 

[Michael Wolfe]

I dont have any experience with fat sleepers, so I'm going to ignore those and say for the other species that you listed you need no salinity (I see all of those fish in anything from ditches to springs).  They all do OK, but some of the mixes that you have selected may not really be comparable.  For example, pirate perch are not really aggressive feeders, so might not get fed if there are dollar sunfish in there.  In the other tank, Gambusia are kinda nasty and might beat up the Golden Topminnows and likely the Molly as well.  And you might not be able to keep any Heterandria for very long... even the adults are really small and prone to being eaten by adult Fundulus.

 

I like all your other plans (no heater, native substrate/plants, etc.) maybe just be a little lower on stocking density (although you didnt say a tank size) or species mix.   

[TurbineBlade]

Agree with the above ^^ post.  I was just going to add that as a general rule, fish living in brackish water systems are hardy and tolerant of fairly wide-ranging changes in salinity.  While I've only applied this theory to natives via mummichogs, before I was eligible for the draft I used to maintain a brackish tropical tank with archer fish and some gobies and they thrived; this was despite the fact that I was far too inexperienced and ignorant at that stage of my fishkeeping career to be keeping them.  

[FishingDavid1990]

I dont have any experience with fat sleepers, so I'm going to ignore those and say for the other species that you listed you need no salinity (I see all of those fish in anything from ditches to springs).  They all do OK, but some of the mixes that you have selected may not really be comparable.  For example, pirate perch are not really aggressive feeders, so might not get fed if there are dollar sunfish in there.  In the other tank, Gambusia are kinda nasty and might beat up the Golden Topminnows and likely the Molly as well.  And you might not be able to keep any Heterandria for very long... even the adults are really small and prone to being eaten by adult Fundulus.

 

I like all your other plans (no heater, native substrate/plants, etc.) maybe just be a little lower on stocking density (although you didnt say a tank size) or species mix.   

 

Thanks for the great info! I thought that Pirate Perch were aggressive. Guess I had the wrong impression of them. Probably the name. lol, 

I was also worried about the Least Killifish getting eaten. I will have to think hard about which species I want to keep. Or just start more tanks. haha. 

Currently I have gathered all the supplies from local creeks, put together the tank, and added 3 female sailfin mollies and 2 Golden Topminnow (one male and one female). I also have some small grass shrimp in there (Its okay with me if they get eaten by something, although I do kinda like them). 

Ive got plenty of cover for them all to hide from each other and to break up lines of sight. 

The mollies are getting more and more adventurous and less skittish when people walk by the tank. The Golden Topminnows hide mostly. The large female will come out sometimes and roam around a bit. More often when the aquarium lights are off rather than on. The male very rarely makes an appearance. 

I have not seen anything aggressively feeding on the flakes and bloodworms that I have tried yet. I have seen them (both mollies and topminnow) tentatively swipe at some flakes every once in a while but nothing that could count as a substantial feeding session as of yet. Getting a little bit nervous about that. 

[FishingDavid1990]

Agree with the above ^^ post.  I was just going to add that as a general rule, fish living in brackish water systems are hardy and tolerant of fairly wide-ranging changes in salinity.  While I've only applied this theory to natives via mummichogs, before I was eligible for the draft I used to maintain a brackish tropical tank with archer fish and some gobies and they thrived; this was despite the fact that I was far too inexperienced and ignorant at that stage of my fishkeeping career to be keeping them.  

That is good to know. thanks a bunch! 

[keepnatives]

I've kept fat sleepers in the past they do fine in fresh water.  Keep in mind pirate perch and tadpole madtoms are nocturnal feeders for the most so feeding them at night (dark) should ensure they get some food.  Also be sure to provide day time hiding areas. 

[FishingDavid1990]

I've kept fat sleepers in the past they do fine in fresh water.  Keep in mind pirate perch and tadpole madtoms are nocturnal feeders for the most so feeding them at night (dark) should ensure they get some food.  Also be sure to provide day time hiding areas. 

Thanks! I have not done my own research regarding them yet, and will do so, but just off the top of your head do you have any recommendations on food for Fat sleepers, Tadpole Madtoms, and Pirate Perch. Does my idea of catching gambusia for them sound okay? Would sinking pellets be a better option? 

[UncleWillie]

I kept a group of pirate perch for a few years.  Feeding them anything other than live food was a struggle, but doable.  At that point in my life, I had the time to pellet-train them.  But even when trained, they were finicky and I had to make frozen foods and pellets move and twitch to seem alive.  When trying to make sure 5 beefy pirate perch got plenty to eat, this was a time-consuming chore every few days.  Before pellet training a got them feeding on gut-loaded crickets at the surface.  Then I moved onto slivers of fish flesh held with tweezers that I could quiver at the surface to mimic a cricket.  Once trained on frozen fish or shrimp, I started them on pellets.  I used the Hikari food sticks.  These things are hardened tube-like food sticks that floated on the surface, but quickly became soggy.  I'd let these things soak up some fish juice (from the frozen fish I'd thaw out) and make them quiver/twitch at the surface.  Eventually the pirate perch accepted these with no pre-soaking.  I also always kept a intermittent supply of well-fed Gambusia as live food.  I notice the pirate perch were poor ambush hunters when the lights were on.  But if I turned the tank lights off they tended to strike their prey or pellets more accurately.

[FishingDavid1990]

I kept a group of pirate perch for a few years.  Feeding them anything other than live food was a struggle, but doable.  At that point in my life, I had the time to pellet-train them.  But even when trained, they were finicky and I had to make frozen foods and pellets move and twitch to seem alive.  When trying to make sure 5 beefy pirate perch got plenty to eat, this was a time-consuming chore every few days.  Before pellet training a got them feeding on gut-loaded crickets at the surface.  Then I moved onto slivers of fish flesh held with tweezers that I could quiver at the surface to mimic a cricket.  Once trained on frozen fish or shrimp, I started them on pellets.  I used the Hikari food sticks.  These things are hardened tube-like food sticks that floated on the surface, but quickly became soggy.  I'd let these things soak up some fish juice (from the frozen fish I'd thaw out) and make them quiver/twitch at the surface.  Eventually the pirate perch accepted these with no pre-soaking.  I also always kept a intermittent supply of well-fed Gambusia as live food.  I notice the pirate perch were poor ambush hunters when the lights were on.  But if I turned the tank lights off they tended to strike their prey or pellets more accurately.

That is all really awesome advice and information. Thank you so much!