Minnow and 2 darter id

I have two shiners and I'm not sure what kind I have. They all look kinda alike to me. My wife caught a darter today and I'm not sure what kind it is. The last id I need is a darter I caught a few days ago, it was really big and it looked like a Rainbow darter, but it was way too big (it was about 5-6 inches long).

Shiner



The darter my wife caught



The 3rd darter looks kinda like the small one my wife caught, except it was 5-6 inches long.

The shiner photos are way too small for ID. The darter is some Percina species of darter, I'm not sure which with my first coffee just now appearing...

The shiner photos are way too small for ID. The darter is some Percina species of darter, I'm not sure which with my first coffee just now appearing...

Here is a short video of them, if it helps. Also this is the Watershed it came from.

After looking at the video I'd vote for the shiners being creek chubs, and the darters appear to be logperch, Percina caprodes. The other candidate darters are sharpnosed and appalachian, and that doesn't appear to be likely.

Oh, I thought they were shiners After looking at pictures of a logperch, I think it is a logperch. Thanks, I've went through a lot of pictures of darters, looking for one that matches it.

That looks like one of the saddled darters. In west virginia, I would bet it is a candy darter. Etheostoma osburni. Around me we have variegate darters which are also saddled darters. Your fish looks very similar to a washed out variegate.
I am not sure on your minnows, but either creek chub, stoneroller or blacknose dace. Better pics would allow for a better ID.

Edit: pretty sure after watching the video again that those are stonerollers. I am about 99% on the candy darter. Good find on the candy darter, you will have to go back there in the spring, and see them in their glory.

I dunno, we might as well be reading a crystal ball for these IDs from available information. If we're talking about a large darter (pictured? not pictured?) logperch is the best bet; a smaller, colorful darter (picutured? not pictured?) candy darter is believable. The cyprinid(s) display a basicaudal spot and a thickened caudal peduncle; but is the mouth terminal or subterminal? Ain't no tellin'.

I dunno, we might as well be reading a crystal ball for these IDs from available information. If we're talking about a large darter (pictured? not pictured?) logperch is the best bet; a smaller, colorful darter (picutured? not pictured?) candy darter is believable. The cyprinid(s) display a basicaudal spot and a thickened caudal peduncle; but is the mouth terminal or subterminal? Ain't no tellin'.

Believe that!

I'm sorry about the pictures, I know they're almost worthless. The things is they have seemed very stressed, and I'm trying not to add to it. I'll take some better pictures of them tonight.

That would be cool if it is a candy darter (I know almost nothing about log perches), I've seen tons of them today. Most are exactly like the one in my tank, but I did see another big one today (looked almost exactly like the other). Today was a good day for darters, just couldn't catch any with my little dipnet.

I'll edit this post later with better pictures...

The darter picture didn't turn out very good, I forgot about how my camera focuses. I'll try and take one soon.

Here's a few of the darter:

I have much to say and not really sure how to go about it, but here goes.

It's really not proper etiquette to take fish home and ask for an ID. You need to do one or all of the following:

Purchase/obtain from library a book adequate for your local identification needs. Your ID's should be done stream side. If your unsure about an ID, you should snap a photo and post it here (leave the fish in the water).

Possession of endangered fish can have serious penalties not to mention we want these fishes to thrive in the wild.
Even though endangered fish have this serious status, they're often locally common. Simply because a fish is easily obtained, should not make you feel comfortable about it's status.

Sorry for the lecture.

I'm sorry about the pictures, I know they're almost worthless. The things is they have seemed very stressed, and I'm trying not to add to it. I'll take some better pictures of them tonight.

That would be cool if it is a candy darter (I know almost nothing about log perches), I've seen tons of them today. Most are exactly like the one in my tank, but I did see another big one today (looked almost exactly like the other). Today was a good day for darters, just couldn't catch any with my little dipnet.

I'll edit this post later with better pictures...

The darter picture didn't turn out very good, I forgot about how my camera focuses. I'll try and take one soon.

Well that there is a stoneroller. Now lets see the darter

I have much to say and not really sure how to go about it, but here goes.

It's really not proper etiquette to take fish home and ask for an ID. You need to do one or all of the following:

Purchase/obtain from library a book adequate for your local identification needs. Your ID's should be done stream side. If your unsure about an ID, you should snap a photo and post it here (leave the fish in the water).

Possession of endangered fish can have serious penalties not to mention we want these fishes to thrive in the wild.
Even though endangered fish have this serious status, they're often locally common. Simply because a fish is easily obtained, should not make you feel comfortable about it's status.

Sorry for the lecture.

I understand what you mean, and I don't mind the lecture at all. I'm new to natives, and you guys really know what you're talking about.

I caught the small unknown darter almost 3 weeks ago. The big darter of the same species was caught and released two weeks ago. In my first post I confused myself, because I had caught a rainbow darter today and added him to the tank.

When the small unknown darter was caught I thought it was a female rainbow darter because of the lack of color. After I checked pictures of female rainbows again I still thought it was a female, it wasn't until I caught the bigger darter that I had doubts. I saw on the Nature Serv website that Rainbow darters don't grow that long. So that's what made me ask for an id of it.

As for the shiners (or so I thought), I thought they were common shiners. I thought that I would ask about them anyway, and to my surprise they weren't shiners at all.

I was also planning on buying that book you recommended in this topic. My local library doesn't have many books on fish, or the ones that I really liked were never returned I've been using Nature Serv and the photo gallery here for identification.

Before I collected any fish I checked on Nature Serv to make sure they didn't have a vunerable status, and I wrote the names of the fish down that I was interested in and fish that are vunerable. I think now I'll print the pictures of fish and take them with me.

Even though endangered fish have this serious status, they're often locally common. Simply because a fish is easily obtained, should not make you feel comfortable about it's status.

I didn't know that. Feel free to tell me anything that I might have not thought about.

Before I collected any fish I checked on Nature Serv to make sure they didn't have a vunerable status

Does Nature Serv keep its fish section current? Every other animal Ive searched seems to be about 15 years late on its information.

I don't know, but it seems like it's the best on the web. What do you mean exactly? What animal information seems to not be outdated?

I would think that they keep up to date information about fish species that are vunerable, extinct, etc...

Edit: I don't really know and I can't find out anything from the site. I think I might send them a e-mail about it. It would help me if you could remember what data was old. So I can put that in the e-mail.

NatureServe, if I understand correctly, lists the native fish in each HUC watershed. By this, I mean fish that are native to the particular watershed in question. It does not list exotics and transplanted natives. It seems pretty good, but does not have everything.

The endangered/threatened statuses of fish (and other species, of course, as well) are updated by states without necessarily notifying NatureServe. It is their "responsibility" to keep themselves informed of these updates. You can't expect them to always be current. You should, however, be able to get the current list for your state from your state's web page. Don't depend on NatureServe; get the information directly from your state (or the state you will be collecting in), print it out, and keep it with you. And check periodically for updates.

For what it's worth I will agree that that is a stoneroller for sure and I agree that the darter is definitely a saddled darter but there have been varigates introduced in parts of WV so it may be difficult to be 100% sure it is a candy darter but I feel confident in saying it is either a varigate or a candy darter which are both in the saddled darter subgenus.