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The "h" Word

Started by Guest_iturnrocks_* , Jul 26 2007 12:47 PM

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23 replies to this topic

#1 Guest_iturnrocks_*

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Posted 26 July 2007 - 12:47 PM

Ive been reading some posts about the dreaded H word and wanted to submit my pic of what I always thought was a bluegill/ green sunfish. I no longer have this fish, but im just curious. It looks more and more like a bluegill when I look at it now. I think the mouth always seemed larger than the others, but I dont have him to compare anymore.

Posted Image

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#2 Guest_Zephead4747_*

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Posted 12 August 2007 - 04:17 PM

Just looks like a fat green sunfish to me

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#3 Guest_fundulus_*

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Posted 12 August 2007 - 04:53 PM

Here we go again... I would say the fish is a bluegill, with the dorsal spot and vertical banding on the body. The mouth doesn't look quite big enough to be a green or green-influenced. Other threads recently have pointed the huge variation in bluegills even in nearby lakes. So even if it looks different from many other bluegills 'twould appear to be a bluegill.

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#4 Guest_fishlvr_*

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Posted 12 August 2007 - 04:53 PM

I think it looks like a hybrid; although, it doesn't look like it has much bluegill in it. Maybe it's a greengill x pure green?

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#5 Guest_fishlvr_*

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Posted 12 August 2007 - 04:55 PM

Here we go again... I would say the fish is a bluegill, with the dorsal spot and vertical banding on the body. The mouth doesn't look quite big enough to be a green or green-influenced. Other threads recently have pointed the huge variation in bluegills even in nearby lakes. So even if it looks different from many other bluegills 'twould appear to be a bluegill.

Maybe, but bluegill don't have the blue lines under their eyes do they? I've never seen any like that. Blugilll also have smaller mouths.

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#6 Guest_sandtiger_*

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Posted 12 August 2007 - 10:36 PM

Are all the pictures of the same fish? I can definatly see green in the first picture with the orange opercule. The second picture does not appear to have that. Either way, they both look like green/bluegill hybrids IMO.

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#7 Guest_bullhead_*

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Posted 12 August 2007 - 11:40 PM

Bluegills do not have a colored edge to the opercule. I like the fat green theory. If bluegills can show large variation, why not greens?

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#8 Guest_iturnrocks_*

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Posted 13 August 2007 - 09:35 AM

Are all the pictures of the same fish?

They are all pics of the same fish but theres about 6 months time between them. The top photo is the most recent.

The 2nd picture down was taken within a few days of capture.

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#9 Guest_dsmith73_*

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Posted 13 August 2007 - 10:47 AM

Appear to be 100% green to me.

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#10 Guest_drewish_*

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Posted 13 August 2007 - 11:38 AM

Now that Dustin has spoken, I'd like to say it looks like a green to me as well.

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#11 Guest_iturnrocks_*

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Posted 13 August 2007 - 12:22 PM

Although I dont know exactly what determines species, I cant see this being a green because the mouth is so much smaller than the other greens Ive had.

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#12 Guest_fundulus_*

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Posted 13 August 2007 - 01:19 PM

The rear extremity of the mandible should extend back to about half of the eye's width for a green, and I'm not sure this fish meets that. But, the blue/green scrolling on the face is a green trait, and the light edging to the dorsal. But the ground pattern of vertical bands is much more a bluegill trait than green. So I'm stumped for a decisive ID after looking. Maybe he actually is a hybrid, as much as I think that's usually too pat an answer.

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#13 Guest_edbihary_*

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Posted 13 August 2007 - 04:16 PM

Black blotches on both dorsal and anal fins. White fringes on the fins (more evident on the first photo, when the fish was older). Black, pepper-like spots on the body, especially near and above the lateral line. Green sunfish.

The color reminds me of pumpkinseed, although we've seen green sunfish like that before. The red tip on the ear flap is also reminiscent of pumpkinseed, but we've occasionally seen that on green sunfish before, also. The mouth seems a little too small for a green sunfish. If I were to accuse this fish of being a hybrid, I would guess green x pumpkinseed. Has anybody ever seen one of those? But I lean toward just an unusual green sunfish.

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#14 Guest_smbass_*

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Posted 13 August 2007 - 10:40 PM

I'd be pretty positive in ID ing this as a hybrid Bluegill x green sunfish. The blue flecks on it's sides don't form the nice neat lines that they do in a pure green and the mouth looks intermediate sized as well. The blue flecks on the side of the body appear stretched and blended into the vertical bars rather than forming the neat horizontal lines. This to me always says hybrid that is at least part green sunfish. This fish also appears too deep bodied to be a green sunfish.

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#15 Guest_JDS_*

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Posted 23 August 2007 - 08:26 PM

Black blotches on both dorsal and anal fins. White fringes on the fins (more evident on the first photo, when the fish was older). Black, pepper-like spots on the body, especially near and above the lateral line. Green sunfish.

The color reminds me of pumpkinseed, although we've seen green sunfish like that before. The red tip on the ear flap is also reminiscent of pumpkinseed, but we've occasionally seen that on green sunfish before, also. The mouth seems a little too small for a green sunfish. If I were to accuse this fish of being a hybrid, I would guess green x pumpkinseed. Has anybody ever seen one of those? But I lean toward just an unusual green sunfish.

Shot at 2007-07-11

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#16 Guest_smbass_*

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Posted 24 August 2007 - 10:43 AM

Shot at 2007-07-11

This definitely looks like a green x pumpkinseed and a nicely colored one at that.

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#17 Guest_Zephead4747_*

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Posted 25 August 2007 - 09:26 PM

I'm positive it's a pure green or at least 75% green.

As stated before if bluegills can have variance why not greens? I've seen dark bars on ym greens and blue speckled pattern on them I can attest to them being 100% green. It's a lot of their mood and the lighting that affect the pattern.
I've kept these fish for months now and I will say that they are 100% green without a doubt. There shouldn't be any doubt here, I've seen more suspicious looking fish taken as pures.

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#18 Guest_Skipjack_*

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Posted 25 August 2007 - 09:43 PM

Zephead, you are messing with SMBASS. His specialty is Lepomis. Get over it.

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#19 Guest_Irate Mormon_*

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Posted 25 August 2007 - 09:55 PM

Zephead, you are messing with SMBASS. His specialty is Lepomis. Get over it.

Well, SMB did mention the "h" word. That's suspect in and of itself! Looks like a variable green, FWIW.

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#20 Guest_fundulus_*

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Posted 25 August 2007 - 10:23 PM

I'm positive it's a pure green or at least 75% green.

As stated before if bluegills can have variance why not greens? I've seen dark bars on ym greens and blue speckled pattern on them I can attest to them being 100% green. It's a lot of their mood and the lighting that affect the pattern.
I've kept these fish for months now and I will say that they are 100% green without a doubt. There shouldn't be any doubt here, I've seen more suspicious looking fish taken as pures.

You're on to a key idea of biology, that within species there can be a fair amount of variation. I'd also say the fish is a green, but from that one photo, that's maybe an informed opinion. I still think the most parsimonious ID is that of a species.