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Great Adventure in Fall of 2008!


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#1 Guest_NativeLover_*

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Posted 05 January 2008 - 05:08 AM

Hello friends and fellow native fish lovers!

Recently, I have not had the space and time to entertain my native fish keeping hobby as much as I would like. Fortunately, I will be graduating college this semester, and will settle into my own place in August of this year. This will allow me to finally have a good-sized tank, and I want to fill it with the beautiful natives that I've read about. In particular, I am fond of some of the shiners I find in my Peterson's Field Guide. So in order to start my tank out right, I am planning a trip through some of the southern states to get the fish I've always dreamed of keeping.

The reason I bring this to your all's attention is because I want you alll to benefit from it as well. I wanted to see if anyone else wanted to embark on this adventure. We can plan it so that everyone ends up getting fish they want. I apologize for wanting to plan it so early, but I want this trip to be beneficial to NANFA members, and others who have passions for native fish. Would anyone be interested in taking a trip in Late July - early August?

My route includes Central Virginia, NorthCentral North Carolina, Eastern Tennesse OR West North Carolina (TN R. Drainage?), and Northern Georgia. There are many Shiners that interest me located in these areas. Is anyone else interested in any fish that reside in these areas?

If any of you all decide you want to go, I was hoping we could be organized, and assign various tasks to people. In general I was thinking that we would ALL collect fish (seining, dipnetting, etc.) On top of that are separate Jobs:

Someone in charge of photography
Someone in charge of maintaining fish holding equipment (keeping fish alive)
Someone in charge of identification
Someone to take specimen samples (pickling the fish to positively identify later)
*Any other jobs you guys can think of that we'll need?

To show my seriousness towards wanting to really plan this and have you all participate with me, is that I will pay for all your food for the trip! I want to show you all that it would be great having you, and I want our trip to be enjoyful and want all of us to get something out of it.

So my fellow fish freaks, anyone think they would be interested for an awesome trip in Fall of 2008? What are your all's inputs and suggestions to this trip? If you want to go, it is your trip too! I want to know what you all think and what you all want to do. Let's make this a trip worth remembering, and come back with some great catches!

Adam from Kentucky

#2 Guest_mikez_*

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Posted 05 January 2008 - 07:50 AM

That sounds like alot of fun! I wish I could participate but unfortunately such travel is outside my budget limitations at the moment.
One thing to consider is the time of year you have selected. Most likely you will experience very warm temps, both air and water. Some fish become somewhat fragile when temps get high. If your travel distance and "bucket time" are long, you may have some problems with some of the sensitive species.

#3 Guest_Casper Cox_*

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Posted 05 January 2008 - 01:24 PM

food provided.
well!
now is it gonna be steaks and catfish or stale cheetos, peanut butter and roadkill?
:)
july and august are the worse months to collect. very difficult to keep them alive while camping and covering so much territory.
you are thinking right with your planning tho, the regions and giving folks responsibilities. it makes for a united group effort and everyone has skills they can bring along.
you will be coming through my region and the areas beyond are very nice. i might me up with you for a couple days.
the nanfa convention is in september.
you should plan a trip more in the spring i would suggest. the fish are prettier and easier to maintain.
i think this is one of your first trips so i would keep it simple, not a mega collect trek.
you dont want to give into the "kid in the candy store" emotions and try to keep everything wonderous you see. better to enjoy the trip and keep a few souvenir fish.
casper

#4 Michael Wolfe

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Posted 05 January 2008 - 03:39 PM

Adam,

I am in N.Georgia so I would certainly be interested in participating during at least the portion of the trip that is close to me... keep me in the loop and I will be abl eto help out some with some of the jobs...

MWolfe

Hello friends and fellow native fish lovers!

I am planning a trip through some of the southern states to get the fish I've always dreamed of keeping.

Someone in charge of photography
Someone in charge of maintaining fish holding equipment (keeping fish alive)
Someone in charge of identification
Someone to take specimen samples (pickling the fish to positively identify later)
*Any other jobs you guys can think of that we'll need?

So my fellow fish freaks, anyone think they would be interested for an awesome trip in Fall of 2008? What are your all's inputs and suggestions to this trip? If you want to go, it is your trip too! I want to know what you all think and what you all want to do. Let's make this a trip worth remembering, and come back with some great catches!

Adam from Kentucky


Either write something worth reading or do something worth writing. - Benjamin Franklin

#5 Guest_killier_*

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Posted 05 January 2008 - 05:57 PM

Hello friends and fellow native fish lovers!

Recently, I have not had the space and time to entertain my native fish keeping hobby as much as I would like. Fortunately, I will be graduating college this semester, and will settle into my own place in August of this year. This will allow me to finally have a good-sized tank, and I want to fill it with the beautiful natives that I've read about. In particular, I am fond of some of the shiners I find in my Peterson's Field Guide. So in order to start my tank out right, I am planning a trip through some of the southern states to get the fish I've always dreamed of keeping.

The reason I bring this to your all's attention is because I want you alll to benefit from it as well. I wanted to see if anyone else wanted to embark on this adventure. We can plan it so that everyone ends up getting fish they want. I apologize for wanting to plan it so early, but I want this trip to be beneficial to NANFA members, and others who have passions for native fish. Would anyone be interested in taking a trip in Late July - early August?

My route includes Central Virginia, NorthCentral North Carolina, Eastern Tennesse OR West North Carolina (TN R. Drainage?), and Northern Georgia. There are many Shiners that interest me located in these areas. Is anyone else interested in any fish that reside in these areas?

If any of you all decide you want to go, I was hoping we could be organized, and assign various tasks to people. In general I was thinking that we would ALL collect fish (seining, dipnetting, etc.) On top of that are separate Jobs:

Someone in charge of photography
Someone in charge of maintaining fish holding equipment (keeping fish alive)
Someone in charge of identification
Someone to take specimen samples (pickling the fish to positively identify later)
*Any other jobs you guys can think of that we'll need?

To show my seriousness towards wanting to really plan this and have you all participate with me, is that I will pay for all your food for the trip! I want to show you all that it would be great having you, and I want our trip to be enjoyful and want all of us to get something out of it.

So my fellow fish freaks, anyone think they would be interested for an awesome trip in Fall of 2008? What are your all's inputs and suggestions to this trip? If you want to go, it is your trip too! I want to know what you all think and what you all want to do. Let's make this a trip worth remembering, and come back with some great catches!

Adam from Kentucky

I too can't really go for the whole trip just a clip of it most likely western NC and north GA

#6 Guest_keepnatives_*

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Posted 05 January 2008 - 06:32 PM

Adam,

Mike Z & Casper have given some great advice. I've been doing long distance trips since the 80's and July & August temps make fish survival real tough. Plus if you go to just one of those areas you can get enough shiners, dace and darters to stock one heck of a nice tank and have time to hit a few nice sites. If you do go for the long haul you may be better off shipping each days catch home hopefully to someone trained to unpack, acclimate them and care for them till you return. Both long term and 2-3 day trips are fun but the shorter ones can provide a lot more pleasure compared to travel time. Get a good home base and spend your time in the creeks around that area a day or two then get home with nice lively fish. Hit another area the next year.

I've done this the last 4 years. Sites in order have been SC, AR, MO, NC and this yr TX the great thing is each year at each of these sites there were seminars on fish topics, an auction, great food and activities and a whole bunch of fish nuts.

This has been a blatant plug for the NANFA Conference, see yah in Texas.

#7 Guest_uniseine_*

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Posted 05 January 2008 - 08:11 PM

food provided.
well!
now is it gonna be steaks and catfish or stale cheetos, peanut butter and roadkill?
:)


This is off-topic.

Casper,
Like the food at NANFA Huntsville in Estillfork, Alabama?


Back to topic:

Yes, Collecting in summer is difficult. I made daily efforts to keep fish alive at NANFA 2007. I loose 5% in the winter and lost 55% at NANFA 2007 in June.

#8 Guest_fritz_*

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Posted 05 January 2008 - 08:35 PM

So Philip, you would like to have the NANFA Convention in January in Minnesota?? :D

Fritz

#9 Guest_uniseine_*

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Posted 05 January 2008 - 11:21 PM

So Philip, you would like to have the NANFA Convention in January in Minnesota?? :D

Fritz


If you supply the auger and the gas ;)

Jim Graham's collecting season starts in November and ends in TN or NC in May. But going by this, I miss being a NANFO (North American Native Fish Observer) and seeing the fish in breeding activities and color. Farmer Todd's videos are converting me into an Observer.

#10 Guest_NativeLover_*

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Posted 06 January 2008 - 01:29 AM

Thanks everyone for the input thus far. It is good to see people interested in the idea and those who offer me helpful criticism.

I understand that temperatures at this date is definately not fish-friendly. My dilemma is that I won't have the space before this date to maintain them if I took a spring trip. And once I am into my new home and have the space, I will surely be starting my career (graduating from college. Yay!). So I probably won't have the time to collect after these dates for a while either. However, I could reschedule if it would be more convenient for others would like a closer-to-fall trip. Yes, this would be my first big trip, I've only done local collecting.

What about problems with transporting fish over a period of days before arriving to the aquarium? I plan to use the power inverter in my car to run air pumps for keeping the fish oxygenated. These can be ran overnight without having much worry of draining all the battery power. I also throw in ice sealed in small ziploc bags. Through my experience it helps to prevent the water from getting to hot, while also cooling the water as a whole, thus making it less stressful on the fish. I've learned this helps to prevent loss.

Casper, it will probably be a mix! You might see some beer thrown in there too... Don't worry, I'll keep you guys fed. Glad to see your interest in coming! Any particular fish you are interested in that reside in those areas?

Killier and Michael, I researched the rainbow shiner and see it resides in N. Georgia. I thought I had seen somewhere that the rainbow shiner was endangered or threatened, but couldn't find anything that says it was. Have you all seen them out in the field in N. Georgia?

Thanks everyone for your input. Does anyone else have experiences to share with these areas? Another shiner I have interest in is the pinewoods shiner. It is stunning in its breeding colors. I believe there are 2 pictures of it at the NANFA photo gallery. I have read they are a federal species of concern, but that means they are still legal to collect, right?

Thanks everyone! We'll get this thing going...

Adam

#11 Guest_killier_*

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Posted 06 January 2008 - 12:23 PM

Thanks everyone for the input thus far. It is good to see people interested in the idea and those who offer me helpful criticism.

I understand that temperatures at this date is definately not fish-friendly. My dilemma is that I won't have the space before this date to maintain them if I took a spring trip. And once I am into my new home and have the space, I will surely be starting my career (graduating from college. Yay!). So I probably won't have the time to collect after these dates for a while either. However, I could reschedule if it would be more convenient for others would like a closer-to-fall trip. Yes, this would be my first big trip, I've only done local collecting.

What about problems with transporting fish over a period of days before arriving to the aquarium? I plan to use the power inverter in my car to run air pumps for keeping the fish oxygenated. These can be ran overnight without having much worry of draining all the battery power. I also throw in ice sealed in small ziploc bags. Through my experience it helps to prevent the water from getting to hot, while also cooling the water as a whole, thus making it less stressful on the fish. I've learned this helps to prevent loss.

Casper, it will probably be a mix! You might see some beer thrown in there too... Don't worry, I'll keep you guys fed. Glad to see your interest in coming! Any particular fish you are interested in that reside in those areas?

Killier and Michael, I researched the rainbow shiner and see it resides in N. Georgia. I thought I had seen somewhere that the rainbow shiner was endangered or threatened, but couldn't find anything that says it was. Have you all seen them out in the field in N. Georgia?

Thanks everyone for your input. Does anyone else have experiences to share with these areas? Another shiner I have interest in is the pinewoods shiner. It is stunning in its breeding colors. I believe there are 2 pictures of it at the NANFA photo gallery. I have read they are a federal species of concern, but that means they are still legal to collect, right?

Thanks everyone! We'll get this thing going...

Adam

no rainbows in northern GA you find those closer to the coast most of the time below the fall line
for pinewoods I've always heard that they are hard to keep alive I would stick to greeheads pure red or the ones I've seen
have been even in the fall they look like that

#12 Guest_NativeLover_*

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Posted 06 January 2008 - 02:24 PM

no rainbows in northern GA you find those closer to the coast most of the time below the fall line
for pinewoods I've always heard that they are hard to keep alive I would stick to greeheads pure red or the ones I've seen
have been even in the fall they look like that


Really? Peterson's field guide has them listed as that being the only spot in Georgia that they exist. Though Peterson's could be outdated. If pinewoods are hard to raise, that is fine by me. I like a good challenge. I am hoping that ultimately having these fish will be able to show my "tropical fish" friends that natives are the way to go.

If Peterson's is outdated, anyone know of other good field guides for native fish? Peterson's is very extensive so I don't know that there is another source out there that would rival it.

Adam

#13 Guest_viridari_*

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Posted 06 January 2008 - 02:29 PM

anyone know of other good field guides for native fish?


If you're going to make a serious go of this trip, you'll want to pick up Freshwater Fishes of the Carolinas, Virginia, Maryland, & Delaware by Rohde, Arndt, Lindquist, & Parnell.

#14 Guest_edbihary_*

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Posted 06 January 2008 - 02:36 PM

I'd be interested in the Virginia part of the trip. Maybe the other places, but the drive starts to get really long. I'd prefer to make it a long weekend (say Friday through Sunday), and save most of my vacation time for a family vacation. You don't need to bribe us with food and beer. The joy of seeing new fish in new waters, and meeting new friends, is sufficient. On the other hand, nobody's going to turn down free food and beer ;-)

#15 Guest_fundulus_*

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Posted 06 January 2008 - 03:56 PM

If you're getting into state books, The Fishes of Tennessee by David Etnier and Wayne Starnes would be good for this gambit too. All sorts of interesting fish show up in east Tennessee, as I'm sure Casper at least could show.

#16 Guest_killier_*

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Posted 06 January 2008 - 04:53 PM

If you're going to make a serious go of this trip, you'll want to pick up Freshwater Fishes of the Carolinas, Virginia, Maryland, & Delaware by Rohde, Arndt, Lindquist, & Parnell.

I agree I use that book all the time its been a great book to id fish in the area

#17 Guest_uniseine_*

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Posted 06 January 2008 - 07:29 PM

<clip>
I understand that temperatures at this date is definitely not fish-friendly. My dilemma is that I won't have the space before this date to maintain them if I took a spring trip. And once I am into my new home and have the space, I will surely be starting my career (graduating from college. Yay!). So I probably won't have the time to collect after these dates for a while either. However, I could reschedule if it would be more convenient for others would like a closer-to-fall trip. Yes, this would be my first big trip, I've only done local collecting.
<clip>
Adam


Maybe garbage cans in the yard? to hold spring-caught fish until summer.

I was pleasantly surprised last summer with 3 garbage cans full of water set in partial shade in the yard. No aeration. Kept a dozen baby Nezzies in one, a dozen 3/4 inch Bluespotted sunfish in another, and Fundulus dispar in the third. The fish even grew.

#18 Guest_Casper Cox_*

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Posted 07 January 2008 - 10:42 AM

killier / robert sez:
no rainbows in northern GA you find those closer to the coast most of the time below the fall line

casper knows:
there are plenty of rainbows in n georgia... in the sky and in the water.

ive also been thinking...
instead of covering so many states and having to deal w/ so many licenses and or permits i personally would pick one nice state / region, base camp, and have quality creek time instead of rush and drive time and setup / take down campsites.

i can find all i can possibly care for in one nice creek. what do you want... a museum or something?
:)

casper

#19 Guest_fundulus_*

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Posted 07 January 2008 - 03:41 PM

Yeah, back to the Rooster Scratch in KY!

#20 Guest_drewish_*

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Posted 07 January 2008 - 05:13 PM

I've done a few long(ish) trips and I agree with the folks advising you to tighten your scope. Pick a watershed or two and focus on those. When you are rushing between sites you miss a lot of things, mishandle fish, and all together not that enjoyable.

I understand that you want to see everything and keep some of them, but there is always tomorrow. You will enjoy much more so if you scale back.



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