An Odd Question About Finding Dead Dogs Streamside

My trip yesterday to the Tallpoosa River system in central 'bama prompted me to ask this question of the list, something I've been meaning to do for a while. At one site we stopped at yesterday, a beautiful, fast-flowing stream called Hillabee Creek, we took a dirt road off of the highway and drove down to streamside under the bridge. We found two executed dogs streamside, one very recent. This recent one had one clean small caliber shot through its head, and was laid out nicely on a low hummock at water's edge. The other dog was under the bridge and had been there longer.

My question to the list is, do you find this kind of dog execution in other parts of the country? I've found it several times in Alabama, once with Casper when we were scouting sites for the 2003 NANFA convention. I never came across this growing up in Maryland/Virginia, or while living in New England. The counties I've found this in Alabama are poor ones that don't have animal shelters, which I'm sure is part of the story here. At least the dogs I've seen seem to have been dispatched quickly. I guess I don't understand the attraction of doing it under highway bridges along streams; it's one of the creepiest things I've encountered doing field work, almost like a ritual sacrifice.

I welcome your comments.

My trip yesterday to the Tallpoosa River system in central 'bama prompted me to ask this question of the list, something I've been meaning to do for a while. At one site we stopped at yesterday, a beautiful, fast-flowing stream called Hillabee Creek, we took a dirt road off of the highway and drove down to streamside under the bridge. We found two executed dogs streamside, one very recent. This recent one had one clean small caliber shot through its head, and was laid out nicely on a low hummock at water's edge. The other dog was under the bridge and had been there longer.

My question to the list is, do you find this kind of dog execution in other parts of the country? I've found it several times in Alabama, once with Casper when we were scouting sites for the 2003 NANFA convention. I never came across this growing up in Maryland/Virginia, or while living in New England. The counties I've found this in Alabama are poor ones that don't have animal shelters, which I'm sure is part of the story here. At least the dogs I've seen seem to have been dispatched quickly. I guess I don't understand the attraction of doing it under highway bridges along streams; it's one of the creepiest things I've encountered doing field work, almost like a ritual sacrifice.

I welcome your comments.

Michael Vick did it!!! Seriously, it is a creepy thing. It's cruel too. A shame really.

Dean

Michael Vick did it!!! Seriously, it is a creepy thing. It's cruel too. A shame really.

Dean

This is actually exactly down the line I was thinking; namely were they a fighting breed, ie: pitbull? Also, dog fighters will use other random dogs as "practice", so were there any other injuries to the dogs?

We saw the same early last year down in AL. I learned quickly to stop inspecting lumps covered with tarp in creeks. I've yet to see the same thing up here. We just get shopping carts, refrigerators, grills, and used tires in our streams.

The counties I've found this in Alabama are poor ones that don't have animal shelters, which I'm sure is part of the story here. At least the dogs I've seen seem to have been dispatched quickly. I guess I don't understand the attraction of doing it under highway bridges along streams; it's one of the creepiest things I've encountered doing field work, almost like a ritual sacrifice.

You found more? Sheesh. Yeah, the ritual part may just be indicative of the pragmatism of taking a dog that you're done with out and shooting it. We dump everything else in rivers, why not dogs too?

That is a BEAUTIFUL site btw. Next time I'm in AL I'm making it a priority to get back there and snorkel.

FWIW, my advisor's wife is from the Panhandle (the REAL Florida part lol). Her father isn't doing very well. He's pissed that they took his guns away from him. When you're "useless", their culture is to go out behind the barn. How strongly is this embedded? Like hollerin' at her in front of everyone in the lobby at the hospice that "none of this would have been necessary if they hadn't taken away the guns" and everyone else there just kinda nodded their heads for saying what they didn't. Different way of living I guess.

Todd

Small caliber "euthanasia" on dogs happens here in north Mississippi as well. While one would not notice the canine what with all the partial deer carcasses with only one hind quarter and upper skirt/tenderloin "backstrap" removed from them. What the everliving farkballs does it take for someone to dump (a)a partial carcass (b)numerous {upwards of a dozen at one site in Holly Springs NF} carcasses ©any rotting flesh near a clean water source. Seriously, what the everliving farkballs?

How do these added nutrient sources affect stream life, if at all?

Sorry, had to brush my sholdas' off.

Generally the dogs that I see are of larger breeds like rotweilers, pits, mastiffs, muts there of etc... which I think is due more to the fact that these are the breeds that are more commonly kept in the rural (I'm talking electricity shared between houses with an orange extension cable rural) places of the surrounding area than to them being used as fighters. Although that crap is very common in our area. The creek bed is where people go to put something "out of its misery." My cousin euthanized a very old half blind cat of my great aunts by taking it and his .22 to the creek bed. Why the creek bed? Is this intrinsic behavior? Tom Fanklin's book "Hell at the Breach" has an opening passage where a litter of puppies is dispatched with a shotgun and a pillowcase... down at the creek.

Why wouldn't we tend to do our dirty work far from our water sources?

Have I just explained baptismal rites to myself?(humour, sic.)

This is actually exactly down the line I was thinking; namely were they a fighting breed, ie: pitbull? Also, dog fighters will use other random dogs as "practice", so were there any other injuries to the dogs?

No, the dogs never look damaged in any way besides gunshot trauma. The fresh one we found yesterday was a small yellow dog that looked generally well-fed.

And Todd, yesterday wouldn't have been a good day for snorkeling. The state had heavy rains on Thursday (luckily) and the creeks we visited were all turbid with heavy loads of red clay silt. Most of Coosa and Tallapoosa counties are poorly managed tree farms, and apparently topsoil runoff isn't a major concern. I'm sure the mainstem of Hillabee is good for snorkeling in a dry spell, and with all of the deer carcasses flushed out (not as creepy as the dogs).

Found it a few times in Tennessee also...

I usually come across dog remains about 1 of every 10 sites in KY and TN. Though most were wrapped in tarps and the only clue to what was inside was a tail, leg or mouth jutting out, so I can't really say what ended their life. My black cat came from the Hatchie River in west TN. Pulled up to a site and got down to the water to find a guy kicking a 4 week old kitten into the creek every time it tried to get out. He left, the kitten actually swam through the water after us as we worked, and it came home with me.

As for deer, during deer season I'd say deer legs are about as common as stone rollers.

I came across two dogs recently. As Drew said we kicked a tarp/blanket thing for darters (we found a single E. jessiae nearby) and discovered a dog. The blanket dog was in Alabama but I also found a decapitated dog in Illinois at a favorite sampling site. The dog was so big we assumed it was a deer. We found the head an hour downstream and thought it was odd there was decapitated dog and deer so close. On the way back we looked at the feet and realized that was the biggest most bloated dog we had ever come across.

What a strange thread!
I hate to even speculate that this is regional or cultural in nature..but in all the years of bopping around in the woods, and rivers here in Michigan, I think I may have seen 2 or 3 dead dogs, and never any that gave me any indication they died of other then "natural" causes. Certainly..never seen anything that struck me as having been executed in the way you guys are describing. It would be interesting to see other "yanks" weigh in on this...anyone else from the north/midwest, seen this sort of thing?
It is officially creepy!

What a strange thread!
I hate to even speculate that this is regional or cultural in nature..but in all the years of bopping around in the woods, and rivers here in Michigan, I think I may have seen 2 or 3 dead dogs, and never any that gave me any indication they died of other then "natural" causes. Certainly..never seen anything that struck me as having been executed in the way you guys are describing. It would be interesting to see other "yanks" weigh in on this...anyone else from the north/midwest, seen this sort of thing?
It is officially creepy!

I've never seen this in NE Ohio anywhere, but I've seen plenty of deer carcasses.

Tom

One site in Missouri had two dead dogs and SRBD. I didn't look too closely. Both dogs were big. One had a number spray painted on the side.

My record is counting 7 dead deer at a river in Arkansas. Hard to count because of all the parts, in various states of bloating and decay. I stopped at seven, judging by skulls, and moved to the upstream side of the bridge. No carcasses upstream.

Check this out....
http://www.foxnews.c...,311798,00.html
I wonder if shelters are disposing the bodies in this way, instead of paying for proper disposal?
-Thom

I'm guessing that the dog with the number was a hunting dog. I've seen a lot of hunting dogs with numbers and/or initials on their sides as a way to ID them. When used for deer, a bunch of hounddogs are set loose and run all over and eventually a deer pops out for the hunter. One tends to lose dogs this way, but it is very popular around here.

These dogs are not considered pets. They are kept in kennels outside, a good owner will take them out to run whether or not hunting is the goal. I've come across some that were lost, and it's funny: they will come close, but not close enough to touch. They will, however, jump right into the back of a pickup if you lower the tailgate!

I'm wondering if a lot of the shot dogs are being put down due to being old/ill. Euthanasia at the vet is expensive. But why they just left it there is beyond me.

One site in Missouri had two dead dogs and SRBD. I didn't look too closely. Both dogs were big. One had a number spray painted on the side.

Well, I hate to sound callus, but better to shoot an unwanted dog than turn it loose to fend for itself. Feral dog packs have become something of an issue in certain places. More dangerous than wolves or coyotes because of a lack of fear of man.

I too have found deer carcasses under bridges. The first time, I was just a kid and had just found a discarded fisherman's vest. As I moved further upstream toward the bridge the smell of decay got very strong. When I got to the bridge I could see a big white thing under the water.. I was creeped out big time but had to force myself to investigate. Just a deer. Phew!

Much worse of a shock that lead to a BIG PHEW, I had taken my boys fishing when they were just little. The ice had just melted from the road side pond. My older boy kept saying "Dad, what's that in the water?" The water was murky and strong wind riffled the water. When I looked I couldn't see much, maybe a piece of trash. I said don't worry, it's trash. He wouldn't let it go and get mentioning it till it was getting on my nerves. Then he said, "Dad, it looks like a hand!". Now I was really getting annoyed but before I scolded him, I took another look. Just then the wind died and the sun came out and I finally saw what he saw - a hefty trash bag WITH A TINY WHITE HAND POKING OUT!!!! HOLY !!!
Well, I couldn't decide, call the cops or check it out. I decided I'd take a closer look before calling the cops. I snagged it with my fishin rod and dragged it to shore. Much to my relief, and then disgust, the bag contained a brick and a four foot long monitor lizard. Someone had tied it in the bag with the brick while it was alive, then tossed it in the lake. The poor thing had managed to claw one front foot out of the bag before it died. Yuck.

Yes, I find animals of all kinds quite regularly under/off bridges and in the woods here in Oklahoma. Many animals are just "dumped" and left to go feral, many are shot, even more (especially cats/kittens) drowned is garbage bags...

One thing that does really make me worry is when I see butchered livestock... Those are gennerally "rustled" cows and you don't want to come up on somebody who is butchering a stolen animal...

Personally, if I had to "dispose" of a dog, I would probably use a large caliber handgun round to the back of the head (must be a midwest/southern thing)... a $.50 round is a lot cheaper than a $500 vet bill...obviously however,I would not leave their body to rot between stream banks!

I find dead dogs fairly frequently along streams in Tennessee and Kentucky, but I don't usually investigate to see if they were shot; ill animals often end up near water, so they could just as easily have been naturally dead strays as euthanized animals. I do know of one spot near a favorite pond of mine where the remains of butchered hogs show up a couple of times a year. It's a little disconcerting, as I'm usually there at night (looking for frogs) and don't see the hog's heads until I nearly step on them. And of course butchered deer are a common sight almost everywhere during the fall and winter; just yesterday I came across a partial carcass left right at a trail head in Land Between the Lakes.

I once found three dead black bears in the Mississippi River, it was a mother with two cubs. But then there was worst flooding year back so the bears were probably drowned in their own den then got carried by currents. It scared me lots and I don't go there that spot any more. When we went to tubing down the river, I feel a bump on my bottom thought it was just log but when I looked down and found out that the bump was just a dead deer. I was so quiet whole trip.....creepy! But no dogs or cats....expect I once found a body of little kid. Poor kid it turn out that he was actually play seek and hide with his babysitter, thought the boat make a nice hide spot but he fell and hit his head on the dock.

I have collected at the Hillabee Creek bridge at least once a year for the past several years and there are always dead dogs and deer there. One of the worst sites for dead animals. We were collecting near Centerville two years ago and had to take a detour onto a dirt road because of road construction. There is a sign on a bridge there stating "It is illegall to dump dead animals from bridge". Didn't know whether to be proud of the county for taking action to stop the practice or embarassed that the sign was necessary.