Well since its going to be a little while before I can get everything I need for my 75g native tank, I want to setup my spare 10g with some minnows and maybe a cray or 2. Since I'm new at keeping native fish I'm going to use this as an experimental tank for myself. To see what species I can find with a minnow trap and seine and decide what species I really like from those that I will try to collect when I do setup the 75g in the next few months.
My first couple of questions has to do with crays. Would it be ok to keep 1 or 2 in a 10g tank? If they eventually get too large for such a small tank I can also eventually move them to the 75g when I get that setup in about 2 or 3 months. Also is it ok to keep these crays with the minnows that I collect?
The other question has to do with substrate. What substrate would be best for this tank? Would I be best off getting some cheap brown gravel at Walmart or would sand be better? I have never used a sand bottom but I also thought about using this experimental tank to try this out as well and see how I like it. Any other ideas as to what substrate would be good in a tank like this would be appreciated.
I'm really excited to finally start collecting native fish!
Help setting up a 10g
Started by
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, Mar 16 2008 05:32 PM
17 replies to this topic
#2
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Posted 16 March 2008 - 05:42 PM
Ohh one other question I have is their diet. What should I plan on feeding both the minnows and crays?
#3
Michael Wolfe
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Posted 16 March 2008 - 07:15 PM
Minnows will usually take flake without a problem, and do quite well with it.
And the crays will eat the minnows, so you won't have to worry about them...
Seriously, I would not recommend putting and crays in with minnow in such tight quarters... minnows actually sleep at night (lay relatively still and everything)... crays are nocturnal hunters and will eat sleeping minnows if given the opportunity.
And the crays will eat the minnows, so you won't have to worry about them...
Seriously, I would not recommend putting and crays in with minnow in such tight quarters... minnows actually sleep at night (lay relatively still and everything)... crays are nocturnal hunters and will eat sleeping minnows if given the opportunity.
Ohh one other question I have is their diet. What should I plan on feeding both the minnows and crays?
Edited by Michael Wolfe, 16 March 2008 - 07:15 PM.
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#4
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Posted 16 March 2008 - 08:54 PM
If you put two crayfish in a ten gallon, you'll probably end up with one crayfish. One crayfish in a ten gallon tank is good. The cajun dwarf crayfish/Cambarellus shufeldtii is an exception to this rule. They are easy going and should coexist with each other. I keep them with small fish and haven't had a problem. They are not, however, native to your area. All crayfish are very easy to feed. Mine eat pretty much everything I offer them.
#5
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Posted 16 March 2008 - 11:04 PM
Well I might give one cray a shot and see what happens. I may just do the tank without one too though.
Does anybody have a suggestion as far as a good substrate to use? I don't want to use stuff out of my local waters for this tank. I will probably have some rocks in there and if I find any native plants that look good I may put them in the tank as well so something that would work well with plants would be good too.
Thanks for the help
Does anybody have a suggestion as far as a good substrate to use? I don't want to use stuff out of my local waters for this tank. I will probably have some rocks in there and if I find any native plants that look good I may put them in the tank as well so something that would work well with plants would be good too.
Thanks for the help
#6
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Posted 17 March 2008 - 07:04 AM
Why do you not want to use stuff out of your local waters?Does anybody have a suggestion as far as a good substrate to use? I don't want to use stuff out of my local waters for this tank.
I would (and have) use substrate from local waters, it has a lot of benefits:
1 - It's free
2 - It's got a mix of sand an gravel
3 - Bonus goodies for the fish to pick through and eat
4 - It looks natural
5 - It's free
Tom
#7
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Posted 17 March 2008 - 07:40 AM
I may use stuff out of my local waters for the substrate. I have been debating on using it or not for this tank. I need to find somewhere that has some nice looking gravel and sandy looking substrate. I have a lake in the middle of town here but the bottom of it is nothing but nasty mud and your not allowed out in the water so I would probably go to a stream somewhere.
If I do use it do I just take a shovel and grab a couple of scoops with that? What is the best method for collecting it and is there anything special I need to do or do I just dump it right in the tank and put water on top of it?
If I do use it do I just take a shovel and grab a couple of scoops with that? What is the best method for collecting it and is there anything special I need to do or do I just dump it right in the tank and put water on top of it?
#8
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Posted 17 March 2008 - 08:23 AM
Also with the stuff right out of the native waters, does it seem to cycle any faster so I can put fish in the tank sooner? Does it make the tank get cloudy if I were to try to clean it with a gravel vacuum or should I actually just kind let it go once I put it in the tank?
Thanks for the suggestions!
Thanks for the suggestions!
#9
Guest_Irate Mormon_*
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Posted 17 March 2008 - 08:57 AM
I built a substrate sifter just for this purpose. Time and the elements have done it in, but basically it is a box with some screen in the bottom of it, which one places on top of a bucket. You wash the fines into the bucket and keep what's left.
I should build another one and put up some photos - it's pretty simple to build.
I should build another one and put up some photos - it's pretty simple to build.
#10
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Posted 17 March 2008 - 10:53 AM
I built a substrate sifter just for this purpose. Time and the elements have done it in, but basically it is a box with some screen in the bottom of it, which one places on top of a bucket. You wash the fines into the bucket and keep what's left.
I may do this, but I haven't decided for sure yet. I will probably only have this tank going for a couple of months till I get everything for my 75g and get that tank going. I will be using the natural substrate in that tank and I may do it for this one too.
As far as the sifter goes, is it a wooden box that you use or just like cardboard one?
Do you let the substrate dry out after collecting it? Wouldn't this end up getting rid of all the helpful "live stuff" in there?
Sorry I know I ask a lot of questions but hopefully they don't sound too dumb
haha. I'm pretty comfortable with my tropical tanks but I'm new to natives and collecting everything on my own.
#11
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Posted 17 March 2008 - 12:01 PM
You could also use a second bucket with lots of small holes drilled in the bottom as a sifter. I've tried that, and it works well enough (sorry, no pictures; mine is also defunct, due to being run over by co-worker).
#12
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Posted 17 March 2008 - 01:31 PM
I bought some pretty natural-looking gravel from Home Depot a couple nights ago. A 60-lb bag cost $3.50 -- compare that to buying the ugly crap they sell at pet stores! The diamter of the stones is a bit larger than I'd like but it looks great and you can't beat the price!
I built a sifter like Irate Mormon described with some 1/8" wire hardware cloth mesh a couple years back. It works great, but not so much when rivers and lakes are iced over here.
I built a sifter like Irate Mormon described with some 1/8" wire hardware cloth mesh a couple years back. It works great, but not so much when rivers and lakes are iced over here.
#13
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Posted 17 March 2008 - 04:52 PM
Thats the problem I have here. The lakes still have a thin layer of ice on them and I don't feel like dealing with the ice at the moment. I may try to get some out of the stream here and sift it but I'm not sure if I will or not.
I might go to home depot like you did jase and see if I can find some natural looking gravel to put in there. Once I get that all setup and get the cycle done, everything will be starting to thaw out so I can start collecting easier.
I might go to home depot like you did jase and see if I can find some natural looking gravel to put in there. Once I get that all setup and get the cycle done, everything will be starting to thaw out so I can start collecting easier.
#14
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Posted 17 March 2008 - 09:28 PM
I buy my rocks and gravel from a local landscaping and pond store. They sell it by the ton, so the prices are very cheap for 50 or 100 pounds worth. And it's REAL gravel, not the plastic coated stuff in the pet superstores. You might look around and see if you have a place like that nearby.
#15
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Posted 17 March 2008 - 10:56 PM
Yeah, the box was made out of wood - some left over 2x10's I had laying around. The bottom sifter consisted of screen supported by 1/4" hardware cloth underneath. This was capped by a piece of plywood with a circular hole cut into it. I had some small strips of wood placed on the bottom so that the whole deal would not slide off the top of the bucket. Easier built than described I guess.
Yeah, most anything smallish living in the substrate was washed out. I didn't bother drying it - once the fines were washed out it went right into the tank.
Yeah, most anything smallish living in the substrate was washed out. I didn't bother drying it - once the fines were washed out it went right into the tank.
#16
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Posted 18 March 2008 - 09:26 AM
Well for this tank I will probably just use some gravel and maybe some sand to mix with it from a home improvement store or a landscaping store. When I go to setup my large tank I will building something like what your talking about Irate to sift through the natural substrate.
Thanks for the suggestions!
Thanks for the suggestions!
#17
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Posted 24 March 2008 - 12:36 AM
Well I finally started this tank up. I picked up a new 10g tank from Walmart and replaced the stock incandescent bulbs with a couple of compact florescent bulbs. For the substrate I got a 50 pound bag of Quickcrete all purpose sand. I expected the sand to be a bit brighter, but instead it is brown and muddy and really looks very natural and native to my area. Right now the tank is extremely cloudy from the sand, which I rinsed out multiple times before putting it in, but I hope that clears up in a few days. I did attempt to change out most of the water today with the hopes that it would clear up the water some, but it is still the same.
Sometime this week when I get a chance, I will be going to a couple of the local creeks to get a few rocks and hopefully a nice look piece of wood as well.
Tonight I placed an order for one of those little plastic containers that the pet stores use to put fish in before they bag them; I will be using this to put fish in when I catch them to allow me to take some pictures for identification. I'm going to be making a few trips the next couple of weeks, when the weather cooperates, to try and catch some fish and ID them. This will allow me to ask questions here and figure out what fish I want to keep in this tank.
If there is anything that I haven't mentioned that I should be doing then let me know.
I also started up a blog that I have in my signature that I will be using to kinda document my tanks and collecting trips so feel free to check that out as well and let me know what you think.
My native fish blog
Sometime this week when I get a chance, I will be going to a couple of the local creeks to get a few rocks and hopefully a nice look piece of wood as well.
Tonight I placed an order for one of those little plastic containers that the pet stores use to put fish in before they bag them; I will be using this to put fish in when I catch them to allow me to take some pictures for identification. I'm going to be making a few trips the next couple of weeks, when the weather cooperates, to try and catch some fish and ID them. This will allow me to ask questions here and figure out what fish I want to keep in this tank.
If there is anything that I haven't mentioned that I should be doing then let me know.
I also started up a blog that I have in my signature that I will be using to kinda document my tanks and collecting trips so feel free to check that out as well and let me know what you think.
My native fish blog
Edited by alter40, 24 March 2008 - 12:40 AM.
#18
Guest_Irate Mormon_*
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Posted 24 March 2008 - 10:56 PM
Good luck - sounds like you have a plan!
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