Orange Spotted Sunfish

Can someone enlighten me as to the reason OSS are in such short supply, and why it seems no one is breeding them for sale?? They seem to be somewhat always in demand but no supply.

Can someone enlighten me as to the reason OSS are in such short supply, and why it seems no one is breeding them for sale?? They seem to be somewhat always in demand but no supply.

People can't find them and the ones that do aren't breeding them. That's my guess.

Can someone enlighten me as to the reason OSS are in such short supply, and why it seems no one is breeding them for sale?? They seem to be somewhat always in demand but no supply.

I emailed the district biologist for my area about them. He says that they're present in the reservoirs and waterways around here, but they don't collect them very often. He says that when they do sampling, they usually only find 2 or 3 L. Humilis per trip.

Yikes! Does this mean they are endangered?? I was hoping to get some next year.

Yikes! Does this mean they are endangered?? I was hoping to get some next year.

No, they're not endangered. I find all this talk about orangespotteds being rare kind of interesting. I've always found plenty of them in silty prairie streams along with the usual red shiners and gambusia. Most of the ones I see are either immature or female, and many people may just not realize what they are when they collect them.

I think the key is it's their apparent rarity, not necessarily actual rarity. Habitat, effort, sampling gear, and investigator error are undoubtedly swaying ones collecting.

well... all that haveing been said if anyone has any of those that they trip over all the time, and are just becomeing a pain to have to walk around my addres is 8725 south sullivan place , terre haute, Indiana 47802

These fish are far from rare, they are extremely abundant in mid-western rivers. Especially those that are large and muddy. The Maumee River in Ohio you can seine up hundreds at a time (but it is not legal to keep them when captured this way). They seem to have a preference for murky (turbid) waters. I have been trying to breed these fish so that they can be provided to more people who are interested in them but they have proven to be somewhat difficult to breed. The methods I use for every other Lepomis species just don't work with these guys. I think it actually has something to do with the murky water and in the case of my breeding attempts the lack there of. I have tried to breed these the last three summers, I have gotten spawns from them every year but the first year I only got 3 young to survive and the following two attempts (despite having multiple nests with viable eggs) 0 young survived. I was recently talking with one of the hatchery managers for the DNR here in Ohio and he told me about some research he was involved in work with walleye where they discovered that the fry needed some sort of background turbidity to enable them to orient them selvse properly in the water column and in turn capture plankton for food effectively. I'm thinking this may be the case with Orangespotted sunfish... Maybe they not only like murky waters but maybe they need them for successful recruitment. So that is what I intend to try next year. If it works this time next year I'll have a couple hundred for sale.

These fish are far from rare, they are extremely abundant in mid-western rivers. Especially those that are large and muddy. The Maumee River in Ohio you can seine up hundreds at a time (but it is not legal to keep them when captured this way). They seem to have a preference for murky (turbid) waters. I have been trying to breed these fish so that they can be provided to more people who are interested in them but they have proven to be somewhat difficult to breed. The methods I use for every other Lepomis species just don't work with these guys. I think it actually has something to do with the murky water and in the case of my breeding attempts the lack there of. I have tried to breed these the last three summers, I have gotten spawns from them every year but the first year I only got 3 young to survive and the following two attempts (despite having multiple nests with viable eggs) 0 young survived. I was recently talking with one of the hatchery managers for the DNR here in Ohio and he told me about some research he was involved in work with walleye where they discovered that the fry needed some sort of background turbidity to enable them to orient them selvse properly in the water column and in turn capture plankton for food effectively. I'm thinking this may be the case with Orangespotted sunfish... Maybe they not only like murky waters but maybe they need them for successful recruitment. So that is what I intend to try next year. If it works this time next year I'll have a couple hundred for sale.

Mother nature just doesnt want to co-operate with us silly humans trying to duplicate her tricks, but dont be deterred Brian, I know you can do it, It seems simple just duplicate a portion of the Maumee in your back yard. I have some mud left from the flooding here this year i could donate, if you wanna pay the shipping

This looks like a worthy challenge. Anyone going to attempt this indoors?

Just a thought on how you could effect continued turbidity without shooting the water chemistry to hell with nutrient loading. Into your breeding set up you could introduce a fine sediment (clay or other colloidal material). This particulate matter would eventually settle out, unless the whole system were blasted with current, which may not be the proper environment. However, after the sediment introduction, settlement deposition locations could be pinpointed and you could put a powerhead (or two or three) on timers to turn on once a day for 5 minutes, or whatever interval and duration required to effect the desired turbid conditions. As I said, just a thought. You prolly already have your ideas figured.

Just a thought on how you could effect continued turbidity without shooting the water chemistry to hell with nutrient loading. Into your breeding set up you could introduce a fine sediment (clay or other colloidal material). This particulate matter would eventually settle out, unless the whole system were blasted with current, which may not be the proper environment. However, after the sediment introduction, settlement deposition locations could be pinpointed and you could put a powerhead (or two or three) on timers to turn on once a day for 5 minutes, or whatever interval and duration required to effect the desired turbid conditions. As I said, just a thought. You prolly already have your ideas figured.

Kaolin and bentonite (forms of clay) could be acquired commercially and used to increase turbidity. I think the energy (turbulence) required to keep particles suspended would be tolerable to larval sunfish. A simple diffuser might be adequate for suspending particles. Frequent water changes with makeup water laced with appropriate clay concentration cpuld be used to keep turbidity up as organics bind particles causing them to settle out.

Outstanding suggestions all, now we just need someone willing to take on this challenge and start pumping out the orange spots, i bet you could make a fortune for awhile til you saturated the market.

Outstanding suggestions all, now we just need someone willing to take on this challenge and start pumping out the orange spots, i bet you could make a fortune for awhile til you saturated the market.

About 100 fish per year will saturate market. A single quality brood could yield ten times that many.

I wouldn't rule out some specific food item the new born fry are obligated to feed on.

I've got half a dozen orangespots that should be ready to breed next spring. At least I hope so. They sure haven't shown anywhere near the color I've seen in books so far. I'm hoping they'll color up when the mood strikes them.
I doubt I'll go so far as to suspend clay in my 30 gallon. I might consider using some naturally turbid water from local rivers though.
I wonder if the dark color of a high tannic content would suit them? I can provide that alot easier.
Are the mid western rivers where they are found of high pH and hardness?

I wouldn't rule out some specific food item the new born fry are obligated to feed on.

I've got half a dozen orangespots that should be ready to breed next spring. At least I hope so. They sure haven't shown anywhere near the color I've seen in books so far. I'm hoping they'll color up when the mood strikes them.
I doubt I'll go so far as to suspend clay in my 30 gallon. I might consider using some naturally turbid water from local rivers though.
I wonder if the dark color of a high tannic content would suit them? I can provide that alot easier.
Are the mid western rivers where they are found of high pH and hardness?

pH near neutral, hardness usually very high. A point to note is that reproduction does occur in clear streams. First feeding larvae are smaller than most sunfishes but I think they will take to consuming freshly hatched brine shrimp. I stress fresh, not just that day.

Kaolin and bentonite (forms of clay) could be acquired commercially and used to increase turbidity.

Bentonite - that's Mississippi's #1 geological resource. It used to be gravel, but now it's clay!

We even have a city named Bentonia.

I was thinking of mixing clay into the pond they are in, I also thought of adding some flow to that pond rather than being completely stagnant which is usually the case in these ponds. Also I just want to be clear that this is all just a hunch, who knows I could be completely wrong and maybe I'm just no good at raising orangespotted sunfish.

The Maumee River does have a somewhat high pH it is typically around 8.5 or so. The bedrock in the area which is often exposed in the river is limestone.

We (including basssmaster) will attempt to rear larvae in aquariums. First run will be in clear water. If no success then we will make water turbid with have a brood and clear with other half. Success equals greater than 500 fish to fry stage.

how soon will you be trying this?