Rainbow darter breeding

I have searched the forums and read some info but was wondering if anyone here has successfully bred rainbow darters. I am interested in giving this a shot but not sure what the requiements would be. I was thinking of using a 20G long for this with a soil/gravel substate a few low light plants, I was thinking of landscaping it so it has some large depressions or pits, and using a small powerhead to add current. The problem is I am guessing either photo periods and/or temps would need to be significantly lowered for a couple months to initiate spawning.

Any thoughts, ideas, comments?

Brian,

I had some Rainbow Darters spawn once for me in a tank when I collected some during the breeding season. They laid a couple of eggs near the outflow from a filter. I didn't collect any of the eggs to hatch because I didn't have any food for the fry at the time.

A friend of mine brought some non-breeding season Rainbows into breeding condition by altering photoperiod and temperature on the tank that the fish were in. Unfortunately, just when the fish were getting ready to breed, the heater on the tank broke and cooked all of the fish. Bummer!

Brian

Forgot to add, this year I have a spawning apparatus that I've made to spawn the Rainbows. I'll be sure to post if it works!

Brian

Brian J. Torreano - Owner
BTDarters
American Native Fish for
your aquarium...and more!
Web: http://www.btdarters.com
Email: bt@btdarters.com
Phone: (262) 268-7489

I've been considering trying myself.
Do a google search on rainbow darter breeding in the wild. There are some very detailed descriptions of rainbow darters breeding in the wild out there that should give useful details.
I did the search myself a long time ago and remember seeing details as specific as depth and velocity of the current and even the size of the gravel grains. I didn't bookmark the sites or I'd give you links.

I will have to try googling again....

Brian do you know the water params of the sites you have collected from? PH, gh. kh?

Brian do you know the water params of the sites you have collected from? PH, gh. kh?

I was out collecting shiners in a local north Alabama creek yesterday, and we found a very gravid female rainbow darter. The water temp. was 6* C (42* F), pH was 8.8, and Total Dissolved Solids was 58 ppm. In truth I don't think those precise parameters are so important since the species is found over a very wide area. But I would guess that mildly basic water that's clean and well-oxygenated is a common denominator. The black darters are now gravid, too, with most adult males approaching peak coloration.

I was out collecting shiners in a local north Alabama creek yesterday, and we found a very gravid female rainbow darter. The water temp. was 6* C (42* F), pH was 8.8, and Total Dissolved Solids was 58 ppm. In truth I don't think those precise parameters are so important since the species is found over a very wide area. But I would guess that mildly basic water that's clean and well-oxygenated is a common denominator. The black darters are now gravid, too, with most adult males approaching peak coloration.

at 42deg farenheit..i figured 50's or low 60's..wow i was way off..any idea how to reproduce those temps in captivity, will a chiller even go that low?

I'm sorry, I meant to say before that you probably don't have to replicate that temperature. I don't they're spawning yet but will soon. Room temperature would be plenty warm; I'm becoming more convinced that these fish respond to changes in day length more than to temperature, at least in a wide range.

I had Rainbow Darters spawn and raised the fry the hard way, with wintering,
and
have raised Orangethroat Darters (just like Rainbows) the easy way.



The easy way:
Catch 2 pair of darters in the spring in the weeks before they spawn.
Put the fish in a CLEAN tank; aged water, tray of gravel, powerhead blowing on the gravel with sponge filter on the input .
Leave the newly caught adults in an aerated bucket overnight to acclimate to room temperature, then put the adults into the 72F tank.
Do not feed the fish. Remove the adults after a week.
Watch for fry after another week. Replace the powerhead with a sponge filter.
Feed newly hatched baby brine shrimp, paramecium, egg yolk suspension, Cyclopes-ease, and/or vinegar eels.

Ok you convinced me to try.
Anybody want to send me some gravid females? [I've got four nice males]

An easy way to get water conditions right: fill the tank from water taken from where you got the rainbows.

My main tank was filled from my own creek, which is packed with rainbow and fantail. Of course, hauling 75 gallons in 5 gal buckets took some time...

Thanks for the replies but collecting a gravid female is #1 not an option as they do not occur in my area (as my freshwater fishes of Texas doesnt list them occuring in this state at all) #2 not IMO captive breeding, it is taking pairs from the wild that are about to or already spawning and giving them conditions to finish what has already begun. I am looking for input on how to initiate spawning in captivity from start to finish. Again thanks for the input.

I suspect you will have trouble getting them gravid in Texas without a chiller.
Using wild caught gravid females is still captive breeding, just a tad easier. You still need to provide the right conditions for breeding and more importantly, successfully raise the fry.
Maybe you're an expert fish breeder that is bored with the "easy" stuff. If that's the case, you should be able to find more challenging species local to you that won't need chillin'.

I suspect you will have trouble getting them gravid in Texas without a chiller.
Using wild caught gravid females is still captive breeding, just a tad easier. You still need to provide the right conditions for breeding and more importantly, successfully raise the fry.
Maybe you're an expert fish breeder that is bored with the "easy" stuff. If that's the case, you should be able to find more challenging species local to you that won't need chillin'.

Yea thats what I was thinking, theres got to be a way to make a chiller..guess I will have to look into this..maybe a small refridgerator that I can control the temps closely for a couple of months..hmmm

Unfortuantely the semi tropical zone i seem to live in is somewhat void of many species of fish that occur a few hundred miles north..I can find only 2 or 3 species of darters in my general vicinity (if I am reading the species maps right or they are accurate), what suprised me was the weather and temp difference 100 miles north or west from where I live. I actually maintain lower tank temps during the summer because of the A/C.

Yea thats what I was thinking, theres got to be a way to make a chiller..guess I will have to look into this..maybe a small refridgerator that I can control the temps closely for a couple of months..hmmm

Unfortuantely the semi tropical zone i seem to live in is somewhat void of many species of fish that occur a few hundred miles north..I can find only 2 or 3 species of darters in my general vicinity (if I am reading the species maps right or they are accurate), what suprised me was the weather and temp difference 100 miles north or west from where I live. I actually maintain lower tank temps during the summer because of the A/C.

Do Texans have basements? If so would it be cool enough? Another idea, why not set up a small conditioning tank or plastic container actually kept right in the fridge, a few to several weeks may be all thats needed?

I will have to try googling again....

Brian do you know the water params of the sites you have collected from? PH, gh. kh?

Brian,

Sorry I didn't get back to you sooner. I took a little break from the forum. I don't know the water params of the sites I've collected from. I'll have to remember to check that this year.

Brian

Brian J. Torreano - Owner
BTDarters
American Native Fish for
your aquarium...and more!
Web: http://www.btdarters.com
Email: bt@btdarters.com
Phone: (262) 268-7489

Do Texans have basements? If so would it be cool enough? Another idea, why not set up a small conditioning tank or plastic container actually kept right in the fridge, a few to several weeks may be all thats needed?

If they do it isnt where i'm at..lol.. That may be workable though..say 4 weeks at fridge temps..lol , May tank temps will actually be cooler in the summer because of the A/C, well i hope I havent been here for the hottest part of summer yet so I may end up needing chillers anyway but I hope not.

Brian,
No problem I doubt it matters but it may help I dont know.

home made chiller- mini fridge or freezer, drill two holes, run hosing from power head in tank into minifridge.Caulk around hole & hose to seal holes. The more coils of hose inside the unit, the longer the water has a chance to cool down before returning back to the tank. use flow regulators to adjust flow to tweek temps & also to stop flow if you need to.

A freezer or refrigerator doesn't have nearly the capacity to chill a tank. They mostly work by insulation, with relatively little actual heat transfer. You want something more like an air conditioning unit for this.

There's an old thread at monsterfishkeepers that works through the math, based on manufacturer's specifications for a typical refrigerator, and it works out to only about one degree cooling below ambient (based on a 90 gallon tank), neglecting heat input from lights and pumps.

A freezer or refrigerator doesn't have nearly the capacity to chill a tank. They mostly work by insulation, with relatively little actual heat transfer. You want something more like an air conditioning unit for this.

There's an old thread at monsterfishkeepers that works through the math, based on manufacturer's specifications for a typical refrigerator, and it works out to only about one degree cooling below ambient (based on a 90 gallon tank), neglecting heat input from lights and pumps.

Thanks for refuting one of the more deeply entrenched urban myths about keeping fish.