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Warmouth in with Longear group?


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#1 Betta132

Betta132
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  • San Gabriel drainage area

Posted 14 May 2015 - 06:44 PM

I have 6 longear sunfish and a few shiners in a 65g tank, getting along pretty well. One is about 4", the others are slightly under 3". The big guy defends his new nest but is otherwise a coward. The smaller ones occasionally chase each other, but the chases go for about 6" and then the chaser loses interest/initiative. All in all, they seem to be getting along well, especially considering that they're Leopomis.

Can I put a 3" warmouth with them and have the arrangement work long-term? I know warmouths can reach 10", but that doesn't seem likely in an aquarium that's not massive. I know I've never caught or seen a wild sunfish that's full size. 

So- 65g, six longears, one warmouth, lots of duckweed, and a few blacktail shiners (maybe, might rehome if anyone wants them). Yes or no? 



#2 Matt DeLaVega

Matt DeLaVega
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  • Ohio

Posted 14 May 2015 - 06:48 PM

Try it. If it fails, eat fish.


The member formerly known as Skipjack


#3 Betta132

Betta132
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  • San Gabriel drainage area

Posted 14 May 2015 - 07:17 PM

I won't be eating anybody if it doesn't work. Sunfish are too intelligent, it'd be like me eating a pet bird or something. 

I can probably find someone to take him, though.

Anyone ever tried this?



#4 Matt DeLaVega

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Posted 14 May 2015 - 07:27 PM

I mixed many fish, however it was in an 8 foot 240. Lots of room but heavily stocked. I would give it a shot. It takes people to try it and learn from it to be able to pass on info. Are you willing to be a guinea pig?


The member formerly known as Skipjack


#5 Betta132

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  • San Gabriel drainage area

Posted 14 May 2015 - 07:53 PM

I just don't want to end up with dead or badly stressed fish. 

I think I'll give it a try, since these are pretty tough fish. 

 

EDIT: We're off to a good start. The five smaller longears just stared at the warmouth, they didn't attack. Even when he wandered into the nest, the warmouth wasn't attacked. My biggest longear just raised his fins and presented his side to the warmouth, apparently saying "Look, I am big" to the warmouth. No lunging, no outright threatening, just a display of size. 

The warmouth is tucked into a spot in the back now, and I distracted the others with food. I think his different pattern and body shape are keeping the longears from seeing the warmouth as a threat or a challenger. 


Edited by Betta132, 14 May 2015 - 08:53 PM.


#6 Sean Phillips

Sean Phillips
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  • Allegheny River Drainage, Southwest PA

Posted 15 May 2015 - 08:44 AM

I think a Warmouth would be fine wih other sunfish, heck I might try it this summer with a multi-species Lepomis school. But watch out for the shiners, they may start disappearing as the Warmouth grows.
Sean Phillips - Pine Creek Watershed - Allegheny River Drainage

#7 gerald

gerald
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  • Wake Forest, North Carolina

Posted 15 May 2015 - 09:01 AM

Predicting the outcome of mixing fish, especially socially complex fish like sunnies, is just a guessing game.  Yes you can be pretty sure a male dollar sunfish will attack any new sunfish up to 3x his size,  but other than that there's too many variables and individual variation in Lepomis to give a definitive answer.  Sometimes they get along fine, sometimes they fight, and that can change at any time.


Gerald Pottern
-----------------------
Hangin' on the Neuse
"Taxonomy is the diaper used to organize the mess of evolution into discrete packages" - M.Sandel


#8 Betta132

Betta132
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  • San Gabriel drainage area

Posted 15 May 2015 - 01:02 PM

They're reasonably large shiners. Does anybody want some blacktail shiners, though? I wouldn't mind getting rid of them if I can find them a good home. I have 3 that are about 3" long, and five 1 1/2" ones being grown out in a different tank.



#9 fishlvr

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Posted 15 May 2015 - 03:41 PM

I kept my warmouth and longears together with no issues. I had some of Zimmerman's northern longears and 3 warmouth, one from him and 2 WC. Longears can be agressive and as mentioned before a lot depends on personalities. Warmouth are generally non-agressive but I've had a couple out right mean ones, and seen the reverse with redbreast. Just keep an eye on them.
Steve Knight

Lower Ogeechee/Ogeechee Coastal Drainage

#10 Betta132

Betta132
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  • San Gabriel drainage area

Posted 15 May 2015 - 04:20 PM

I have Central Texas longears, they aren't very big. The largest ones I've seen are a bit under 5" long, and my 4" one has completely stopped growing. 

They seem to be getting along well. There hasn't been the initial new-guy-chasing that I expected. There was one incident where one of the smaller sunnies tried to claim a spot that the warmouth had just vacated, and they had an 'argument' that consisted of the warmouth repeatedly trying to slip into the spot and the longear making short little runs at him. The warmouth has now just drifted off, and he's floating around inspecting things. Aside from that, the longears have left him alone, and they really just don't seem interested. 

I like this guy. He looks like a predator, kind of like a leaf-fish. The longears don't look like hunters, but this guy does, especially with that mouth. And he's kept his pattern, though his colors don't contrast as much. 


Edited by Betta132, 15 May 2015 - 04:21 PM.


#11 Betta132

Betta132
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Posted 18 May 2015 - 01:48 AM

That warmouth is now totally adjusted, as far as I can tell. He's completely unafraid of me. In fact, he follows me around the room as much as possible, watching me do stuff. Also, he's gladly accepting bloodworms, and his colors have fully returned. He acts like most large-ish predators do; like he knows exactly where he's going and what he's doing. Confident little boy. 

I caught some nice adult warmouths about 40 feet downstream of his capture site today. They were very pretty, and I'm assuming they're from the same genetic stock as this fellow, so I believe he'll be developing a bit of a gold tinge when he grows up.

Any tips on a diet to offer him in order to develop his best colors as he grows? I can't feed anything with gluten in it, due to severe allergies in the family. Right now, I give my longear sunnies table shrimp, the occasional clam meal, and bloodworms. I try to give them cichlid pellets, but only the biggest one will take them. The rest bite them and then spit them out. 



#12 gerald

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Posted 18 May 2015 - 08:45 AM

My mud sunfish gets all the cockroaches, crickets, moths, flies, and spiders that stray into my house (in addition to earth worms, pellets, cooked shrimp)


Gerald Pottern
-----------------------
Hangin' on the Neuse
"Taxonomy is the diaper used to organize the mess of evolution into discrete packages" - M.Sandel


#13 fishlvr

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Posted 18 May 2015 - 09:32 AM

Hikari cichlid gold pellets, shrimp, bloodworms etc. They'll learn to take pellets some just take longer. If you don't feed them for a few days they'll be more willing.
Steve Knight

Lower Ogeechee/Ogeechee Coastal Drainage

#14 Michael Wolfe

Michael Wolfe
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  • North Georgia, Oconee River Drainage

Posted 18 May 2015 - 10:54 AM

Sandwich likes massivore pellets and his nice colors come from mostly that diet. But ha also likes freeze dried krill or shrimps. And if course he appreciates the kind of things Gerald mentions.
Either write something worth reading or do something worth writing. - Benjamin Franklin

#15 Betta132

Betta132
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  • San Gabriel drainage area

Posted 18 May 2015 - 12:31 PM

Unfortunately, most prepared fish foods have gluten. I'll add krill into their diet, I know it's good for color.

I'm starting to think the longears are mistaking the warmouth for a leaf or something. They're absolutely ignoring him, even when he's right in their way. If he didn't move, they'd run into him. It's not chasing, it's just a longear going somewhere and apparently not seeing the warmouth. 

Maybe they just don't see him as another sunfish? 






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