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#1 Guest_teleost_*

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Posted 11 September 2006 - 04:40 PM

I keep pirate perch (along with others) in a 55 gallon tank. I keep water extra clean with 2 T per 5 gallons salt. I seem to have a reoccurring problem in just this one tank (every 3-6 months). Younger fish can be affected but usually only the older fish die when these outbreaks occur. The fish bloat up then fail to eat properly until the fish are unable to right themselves. I've used Minocycline in the past with limited success.

Over the past year and a half I've lost quite a few fish in this tank, all from the same problem.

Any thoughts on what I might have and how to treat?

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#2 Guest_Aqua Trooper_*

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 02:29 AM

That's the biggest pirate perch I've ever seen, and I have seen a lot of them. Holy crap.

:shock:

#3 Guest_nativeone_*

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 10:12 PM

may sound odd but seperate them off and add some epsom salt to the water. it works as a laxative and I have had a pretty good success rate with it, as I know what your going through. try to catch it early if possible and you have better chance of saving fish, once it gets as bloated as one in pic then you usually is way to late to save it. some signs to look for is hiding in the corners ect. espicially during feeding time, ( not feeding or spitting out food) hope this helps

#4 Guest_hmt321_*

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 10:43 PM

may sound odd but separate them off and add some Epsom salt to the water. it works as a laxative and I have had a pretty good success rate with it, as I know what your going through. try to catch it early if possible and you have better chance of saving fish, once it gets as bloated as one in pic then you usually is way to late to save it. some signs to look for is hiding in the corners ect. espicially during feeding time, ( not feeding or spitting out food) hope this helps


I add epsom salt into my tank water as a source of Mg for my plants, I do not think that it acts as a laxative, but i do not have any data to support that at this time.
For my heavily planted 125 gal with co2 injection, i add 12 tsp of Epsom salt to the tank at each water change (50%).
Nativeone I would love to see any information that you have on your dosing of Epsom salt (#of tsp per gal, and how often)
I am sure that adding Epsom salt to your water will monkey(good?, bad?) with your GH, and possibly the Kh of your water.
I know that a common cure for Itch is to add aquarium salt, and heat. The heat speeds the life cycle of Itch, and the aquarium salt adds to the slime coat (which helps shed new Itch spores), perhaps nativeone is seeing the same result??
Increase in dissolved solids in water = increased slime coat = more protection from parasites ????? i don't know

I would like to state that i have never had this problem in a tank. (thank God)

my 2 cents

#5 Guest_teleost_*

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Posted 28 September 2006 - 04:37 PM

may sound odd but seperate them off and add some epsom salt to the water. it works as a laxative and I have had a pretty good success rate with it, as I know what your going through. try to catch it early if possible and you have better chance of saving fish, once it gets as bloated as one in pic then you usually is way to late to save it. some signs to look for is hiding in the corners ect. espicially during feeding time, ( not feeding or spitting out food) hope this helps


I'm not sure I understand why I would add epsom salt for this condition. I understand you can use epsom salt as a laxative but this fish has raised scales (even it's flesh became bloated). I might be missing something here so please elaborate if possible.

I can see this condition from a mile away, if it works I would be happy. Do you have any ideas of the root cause?

#6 Guest_nativeplanter_*

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Posted 28 September 2006 - 06:55 PM

It looks like dropsy to me. I looked around the web to find a good explanation - this one is pretty good. It talks about the various causes and treatments. http://aquaworld.net...ease/Dropsy.htm

Basically, the site says that the cause is either viral (with secondary bacterial infection), or organ malfunction due to overfeeding.

#7 Guest_teleost_*

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Posted 28 September 2006 - 07:04 PM

It looks like dropsy to me. I looked around the web to find a good explanation - this one is pretty good. It talks about the various causes and treatments. http://aquaworld.net...ease/Dropsy.htm

Basically, the site says that the cause is either viral (with secondary bacterial infection), or organ malfunction due to overfeeding.


I would agree. This fish exhibits classic dropsy symptoms. I've had a hard time figuring out the root cause. I was able to control feedings to all pirate perch so I don't think this is the cause. The condition pops up every 3-6 months but in different fishes and severity. It's almost like clockwork. It never effects a different genus in an outbreak and once a fish survives the "dropsy" they never seem to suffer from any symptoms again. This only happens in one tank.

I think I've beat this issue to death.

#8 Guest_nativeone_*

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Posted 28 September 2006 - 07:54 PM

as for the my reason for using the epsom, lots of bloat either caused by parasites or infection usually causes the scales to stick up as it gets really bloated due to the stretching of the body. I usually seperate the fish. in a bare tank, ususally a 2-5gallon if fish is small enough, as 2 would be ok for pirate perch, I add 1 tbl spoon per gallon on first day, second day i had another 1 tbl spoon per gallon, this usually forces their system to purge. on third day i do a 50% water change, and next day do another 25% change. if bloat is not gone I do it again, the most I have ever gone is three times with this on one fish and it was far gone, by purging the system it helps rid the fish of a lot of stress by getting rid of the bloat which causes other problems, example the skin being stretched till the scales pop up and starvation the fish always fills full so it starves itself, thats why I said look for spitting of food or not eating. once you rid the fish of this stress, just regular aquarium salt can help alot, ofcorse then you have to find out why the fish got bloated anyways. and treat for that. but in my experience some times the epsom salt cures it and there are no other problems, sometimes it is just a temporary fix till i can accuratly diagnose and treat., I hope this helps, as I said this has worked for me a few times, I actually learned this trick with african cichlids as bloat is a common disease with them,

#9 Guest_teleost_*

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Posted 29 September 2006 - 03:13 PM

Thanks Nativeone, I'll give it a try.




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