A few shiners
#1 Guest_drewish_*
Posted 08 January 2008 - 10:05 PM
Rosefin Shiner, Lythrurus ardens
rosefin.jpg 15.59KB 5 downloads
Rosyface Shiner, Notropis rubellus
rosyface.jpg 13.84KB 1 downloads
Comely Shiner, Notropis amoenus
comely.jpg 13.58KB 1 downloads
#2 Guest_NateTessler13_*
Posted 08 January 2008 - 11:36 PM
#3 Guest_drewish_*
#4 Guest_ashtonmj_*
Posted 09 January 2008 - 07:05 AM
Does anyone one want to weigh in, chastise me, and maybe change my mind, on the ID I gave for comely shiner? Melanophores underneath on the chin, dorsal fin (8 rays) compressed trick worked, somewhat lack of caudal spot, dusky snout.
#5 Guest_drewish_*
Posted 09 January 2008 - 10:57 AM
I was having issues taking the pics so I probably blocked all my light.
I did more digging last night in FoVA and I'm pretty sure it is comely. I just took a couple when Bernie and I went after our trip to confirm. They were a lot easier to ID than when we went.
OH! I don't remember if I told you but we had about 7-8 shiner species in one seine pull.
#6 Guest_ashtonmj_*
Posted 09 January 2008 - 11:02 AM
#7 Guest_daveneely_*
Posted 09 January 2008 - 12:30 PM
Minimally, it's worth having a vouchered specimen somewhere.
#8 Guest_drewish_*
Posted 09 January 2008 - 12:50 PM
I don't have the resources to preserve. Is there an easy way to do so and who wants it?
#9 Guest_fundulus_*
Posted 09 January 2008 - 12:54 PM
VirginiaTelescopeMaybe.jpg 14.86KB 1 downloads
#10 Guest_ashtonmj_*
Posted 09 January 2008 - 01:07 PM
I left my personal vouchers in TN. I had to pick between a half a closet of shells or a couple jars of dead fish, the fist lost.
#11 Guest_teleost_*
Posted 09 January 2008 - 01:19 PM
Notropis_telescopus_Telescope_Shiner.jpg 16.1KB 0 downloads
I've never seen a Comely shiner so I have no input.
#12 Guest_drewish_*
Posted 09 January 2008 - 01:36 PM
So if it is indeed telescope, we could have both telescope AND comely at that location?
#13 Guest_ashtonmj_*
Posted 09 January 2008 - 01:40 PM
#14 Guest_daveneely_*
Posted 09 January 2008 - 02:23 PM
from http://www.flmnh.ufl...ts/R1NE1998.htm
"In 1997, Mike [Pinder, with VDGIF] and Paul Bugas, Region 4 Fisheries Manager, continued survey of upper James River streams for roughhead shiner, a state species of special concern. Of the four historical sites known for roughheads, telescope shiners have taken over, fulfilling the prediction of Bob Jenkins back in the 1970's. Mike will continue surveying sites in the 1998 field season."
I've checked online databases for fish collections at VIMS and NMNH and didn't find any records from the lower portion of the drainage, or even any near where you picked them up. It might be worth dropping either Mike Pinder or Mark Kopeny (an ichthyologist at UVA) an email and asking if they are aware of this population, or if telescope shiners are not even more widely distributed on the Piedmont by now...
#15 Guest_drewish_*
Posted 09 January 2008 - 02:32 PM
I'll also send a clearer and larger picture to Mike Pinder and see what he says. I've already promised him pics from my trips but that was pre-permit.
#16 Guest_drewish_*
Posted 09 January 2008 - 03:02 PM
Will let you guys know what I find out.
#17 Guest_ashtonmj_*
Posted 09 January 2008 - 04:46 PM
#18 Guest_fritz_*
Posted 09 January 2008 - 06:52 PM
Nabbed the data sheet and just saw I wrote Comely shiner (?) Telescope shiner (huh?). Probably didn't include that in the list when I PM'ed it to you because I couldn't remeber them, looked at the book, and saw my comment and thought "no way".
definitely not comelys. agree with telescope ID.
#19 Guest_drewish_*
Posted 10 January 2008 - 11:49 AM
What makes them "definitely" not comely? I know the scales were mentioned previously, is that what you are going by?
#20 Guest_fritz_*
Posted 13 January 2008 - 01:27 PM
Fritz,
What makes them "definitely" not comely? I know the scales were mentioned previously, is that what you are going by?
Sorry for taking so long. I am big into gestalt identification - just know what it is but sometimes hard to articulate.
comelys are more elongate and slender than the telescope. and as mentioned earlier the dorsolateral scales are different. The origin of the dorsal fin is significantly behind the pelvic fin origin in the comely. In telescope is basically directly above it. The dorsal fin in the telescope is larger and more pointed than in the comely. the comely has more pointed snout - rounder in telescope. lateral line is usually unpigmented in the comely. and on and on. hope this helps.
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