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Middlenose gar


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#1 Guest_choupique_*

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Posted 04 February 2009 - 11:59 AM

This is off the other message about the croc gars, hybrids produced artificially. This is my medium nose gar, made at the same hatchery my croc gars were.

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#2 Guest_Brooklamprey_*

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Posted 04 February 2009 - 07:30 PM

Awesome man! thanks for posting that!
Pretty sure your the only one out there with one of these at this time.

Amazing how well you can pick out the specific traits of both the Long and short on that fish.

#3 Guest_Uland_*

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Posted 04 February 2009 - 08:56 PM

Hey Richard, do you still have the dorsal shots of that odd "garvana" fish?

#4 Guest_Brooklamprey_*

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Posted 04 February 2009 - 09:10 PM

Hey Richard, do you still have the dorsal shots of that odd "garvana" fish?


Sure do..
Medius_Dorsal.jpg
medius.jpg
mediusfullfish.jpg
Still kicking myself for not taking some samples or not just dragging that fish out of there for further work.

#5 Guest_choupique_*

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Posted 04 February 2009 - 11:32 PM

Actually a friend of mine has one from the same batch, but he does not get into clubs or anything like that. His looks a lot different than mine in color, but the body shape and proportions are nearly identical.

I also noticed I posted calling middlenose a mediumnose, hope I did not cause any confusion, my mistake. It is true you can clearly see both fish in this one. The crocs on the other hand, you can tell they are not one or the other, but its a bit more hazy. Sort of like they are mixture blend instead of a neat half and half blend with traits clearly expressed in the mediumnose. There I did it again, I mean middlenose.

#6 Guest_Uland_*

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Posted 04 February 2009 - 11:37 PM

Still kicking myself for not taking some samples or not just dragging that fish out of there for further work.


Either you can come out this year and we can hunt another one down, or I can take some fin clips for you. That reminds me....what are those tiny plastic vials called? I would like a cheap source for them.

Edit: nevermind, I just found 5ml transport vials.

Edited by Uland, 04 February 2009 - 11:45 PM.


#7 Guest_Brooklamprey_*

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Posted 05 February 2009 - 12:21 AM

Actually a friend of mine has one from the same batch, but he does not get into clubs or anything like that. His looks a lot different than mine in color, but the body shape and proportions are nearly identical.

I also noticed I posted calling middlenose a mediumnose, hope I did not cause any confusion, my mistake. It is true you can clearly see both fish in this one. The crocs on the other hand, you can tell they are not one or the other, but its a bit more hazy. Sort of like they are mixture blend instead of a neat half and half blend with traits clearly expressed in the mediumnose. There I did it again, I mean middlenose.


I like to call them Lepisosteus Medius... Or Middlenose or MediumNose... I'd really like to give this a new designation Like Croc type 4 (Short X Long) just to easily define it. Might just do so..Only thing waiting is a bit more documentation.

We know the fish exists but it has been difficult to show examples. Only a small handful of captive produced and wild produced fish have surfaced. Yours still stands as a key one Much like Solomans Type 2 (Gator x platyrhincus).

Wild Medius seem to show some different traits in snout development but this is not surprising as this type of plasticity seems to be common in gars. One way or another though it always seems to fit a Medium between the two fish. It is not one but not the other either.

Either you can come out this year and we can hunt another one down, or I can take some fin clips for you.

Plan on us this year :) but if you get one before then nab a fin clip...

#8 Guest_NateTessler13_*

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Posted 06 February 2009 - 11:26 AM

When is Garvana again? I don't know why it doesn't just come as a standard holiday on calendars these days.

#9 Guest_Uland_*

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Posted 06 February 2009 - 12:31 PM

I think we might shoot for a late June trip this year or perhaps the second weekend in July.

#10 Guest_Brooklamprey_*

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Posted 06 February 2009 - 12:37 PM

I think we might shoot for a late June trip this year or perhaps the second weekend in July.


That will work better than in August... Will have to look into getting permits to use a small barge shocker.
Need to plan a trip to a certain Spotted (Both red and Gar) site too..

#11 Guest_E_americanus_*

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Posted 10 February 2009 - 12:45 AM

hey guys,

just catching up on this thread...don't get on the forum nearly as much as i would like.

anyway, i would definitely like to head out to garvana again...and take plenty of samples as well. Uland, i have almost an unlimited (well, a lot) supply of those vials, so let me know if you need some and i can send them...maybe you can nab us some samples during your collecting as well.

as richard said (and i've mentioned this to uland too), it would be good to get a couple folks to go out with us on our gar-spotting trips as we could use the extra hands.

the medium nosed gars (i like medius for short...no pun intended) seems to be quite the conundrum. do they truly exist in the wild? probably...proving it will take the genetic samples/analyses we are aiming for. it seems that since all the gar species could feasibly hybridize, they must exist...would be interesting to know if they could actually reproduce or not, and how long they have been this way. on a similar note, a recent paper is suggesting that an isolated population of tropical gars in central America could be considered a new species given genetic testing...who knows?

If anyone is interested in that article please email me (E_americanus@hotmail.com) or also richard, since i sent it to him a few weeks back.

thanks for posting the pics ray, i would definitely like to see more if you can get them. richard, i of course enjoy seeing those pics...pretty sure we exchanged taking some of those, haha.

will try to keep tabs on the gar talk on here more...this week we're ageing spotted gar otoliths and branchiostegal rays...may have to post some pics in the near future.--
--solomon



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