I'm having a problem with the Black Nosed Dace in 75 gallon tank. Quite frankly they are all turning into fat fish.My wife and I named the biggest one Shammu it's so big. I have sunfish of various sizes and species(bluegill and Green) and some Shiners but the Dace are more aggressive feeders or just faster and they are getting most of the food.I only feed the fish once a day and I don't want to deny the other fish who are not fat their food.Would adding more current to the tank maybe help?
Overweight Dace
Started by
Guest_davidjh2_*
, Feb 25 2011 09:15 AM
10 replies to this topic
#2
Guest_exasperatus2002_*
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Posted 25 February 2011 - 10:39 AM
I'm having a problem with the Black Nosed Dace in 75 gallon tank. Quite frankly they are all turning into fat fish.My wife and I named the biggest one Shammu it's so big. I have sunfish of various sizes and species(bluegill and Green) and some Shiners but the Dace are more aggressive feeders or just faster and they are getting most of the food.I only feed the fish once a day and I don't want to deny the other fish who are not fat their food.Would adding more current to the tank maybe help?
More current & skipping one day a week wont hurt them either.
#3
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Posted 25 February 2011 - 10:40 AM
I think this is a common thing. Most of my shiner/minnows/dace are fat, including my blacknose. They lose that slender body that they have in the creeks. I assume it's from not swimming up and down streams. I have current in my tank, but most of my shiners stay away from it. I can't figure out why they swim in current in the creeks, but wont in the tank. From time to time I see some of my Saffron Shiners swimming in the current, but not a lot.
How much current do you have in the tank?
How much current do you have in the tank?
#5
Guest_mywan_*
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Posted 25 February 2011 - 02:00 PM
I suspect this behavior in creeks is more about obtaining food than an environmental preference in itself. In a creek, with a fair amount of competition for food sources, the fast moving regions would more likely wash up worms and other small (in)vertebrate clinging on and under stones as well as under the soil. This strategy depends on speed which explains why they are able to consume the lions share of food during feeding in an aquarium, resulting in fat dace. Unlike in the wild, where the different species have different hunting strategies to fulfill different niches, in the aquarium there is only a single food source which they directly compete for. I have seen a dace eat a Southern Two-lined Salamander (Eurycea cirrigera) that was longer than it was, leaving the salamander tail hanging out of its mouth.I can't figure out why they swim in current in the creeks, but wont in the tank.
Edited by mywan, 25 February 2011 - 02:01 PM.
#6
Guest_EricaWieser_*
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Posted 25 February 2011 - 03:28 PM
This is true, and it's a good reason to feed your fish tank with a variety of foods. When I had a community tank, I used to feed with crushed flake food, sinking pellets, microworms, blackworms, and algae tablets. I also used to use a cheese grater to finely shred frozen cocktail shrimp. The variety of foods means every fish in the tank gets some. It also helps to feed the flake food first so the overeager fish get bloated on the cheap stuff, and then to feed with the more meaty things. *evil cackle*Unlike in the wild, where the different species have different hunting strategies to fulfill different niches, in the aquarium there is only a single food source which they directly compete for.
#7
Michael Wolfe
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Posted 25 February 2011 - 03:35 PM
I suspect this behavior in creeks is more about obtaining food than an environmental preference in itself. In a creek, with a fair amount of competition for food sources, the fast moving regions would more likely wash up worms and other small (in)vertebrate clinging on and under stones as well as under the soil. This strategy depends on speed which explains why they are able to consume the lions share of food during feeding in an aquarium, resulting in fat dace. Unlike in the wild, where the different species have different hunting strategies to fulfill different niches, in the aquarium there is only a single food source which they directly compete for. I have seen a dace eat a Southern Two-lined Salamander (Eurycea cirrigera) that was longer than it was, leaving the salamander tail hanging out of its mouth.
This is right on the money... I believe there have been some sudies done that show that something like 90% of the gut contents of some of these dace / shiners is actually terrestrial insects... so these insects from the air to land around the stream (not from underwater) are falling in and being carried along by the current... so the food is in the current... and dace / shiners are pigs... its just that they swim so much in such fast current that they are slender pigs... until you deliver the food to them every day... then they dont stay so slender...
By the way, this is also probably why they addapt to aquariums so easily... they are already 'trained' by their environement to look for food that 'drops' into the water... dropped by the wind or the tree branch... dropped by the guy outside the tanks... either way is the same... also why they take to flakes so easily... if it falls from teh sky and floats on the surface for a minute I better eat it before someone else does...
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#8
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Posted 25 February 2011 - 03:57 PM
I failed to consider the terrestrial insect issue, even though I should have as it is an extremely significant food source for many aquatic species. But it does continue to fit the idea behind the daces niche related skills. I appreciate the gut content analysis. These details are more important than all the authoritative claims in the world.This is right on the money... I believe there have been some sudies done that show that something like 90% of the gut contents of some of these dace / shiners is actually terrestrial insects... so these insects from the air to land around the stream (not from underwater) are falling in and being carried along by the current... so the food is in the current... and dace / shiners are pigs... its just that they swim so much in such fast current that they are slender pigs... until you deliver the food to them every day... then they dont stay so slender...
By the way, this is also probably why they addapt to aquariums so easily... they are already 'trained' by their environement to look for food that 'drops' into the water... dropped by the wind or the tree branch... dropped by the guy outside the tanks... either way is the same... also why they take to flakes so easily... if it falls from teh sky and floats on the surface for a minute I better eat it before someone else does...
#9
Guest_davidjh2_*
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Posted 25 February 2011 - 04:42 PM
I have two small circulation pumps in the tank but only one is turned on. Plus I have the water flow from the 2 filters I'm running, one hang on back and one canister. There is decent current just not strong current.I think this is a common thing. Most of my shiner/minnows/dace are fat, including my blacknose. They lose that slender body that they have in the creeks. I assume it's from not swimming up and down streams. I have current in my tank, but most of my shiners stay away from it. I can't figure out why they swim in current in the creeks, but wont in the tank. From time to time I see some of my Saffron Shiners swimming in the current, but not a lot.
How much current do you have in the tank?
#10
Guest_FishheadDave_*
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Posted 25 February 2011 - 07:29 PM
With regards to the fish swimming in the current, I believe a number of studies have also shown a change in fish behavior in the presence or absence of predators.
As for the overweight dace, I'm not especially convinced this is really a problem. Its certainly not uncommon to see "obese" fish in the wild. In streams, many fishes feed very sporadically, with bursts of consumption (and growth) associated with temporal changes in food availability. As others have said, gravid females will also appear corpulent. I've never heard of a fish dying of obesity, and I doubt that your dace are "unhappy" as a result. Even still, I suspect you could cut your feeding back significantly and they would be just fine. When I've kept dace in the past, I've fed them roughly every other day, with no apparent issues.
Good luck!
As for the overweight dace, I'm not especially convinced this is really a problem. Its certainly not uncommon to see "obese" fish in the wild. In streams, many fishes feed very sporadically, with bursts of consumption (and growth) associated with temporal changes in food availability. As others have said, gravid females will also appear corpulent. I've never heard of a fish dying of obesity, and I doubt that your dace are "unhappy" as a result. Even still, I suspect you could cut your feeding back significantly and they would be just fine. When I've kept dace in the past, I've fed them roughly every other day, with no apparent issues.
Good luck!
#11
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Posted 26 February 2011 - 01:18 AM
I had overweight shiners and the oddly sausage shaped overweight darters without any issue before.
I only seen one fish whose weight I thought could possibly be detrimental, and that was a huge and very overweight Brook Trout in the Cabelas store in Hartford Connecticut who looked so big as it sat on the bottom I wondered if it could actually move.
Plus a trout just sitting on the bottom seemed odd to me.
I only seen one fish whose weight I thought could possibly be detrimental, and that was a huge and very overweight Brook Trout in the Cabelas store in Hartford Connecticut who looked so big as it sat on the bottom I wondered if it could actually move.
Plus a trout just sitting on the bottom seemed odd to me.
Edited by FirstChAoS, 26 February 2011 - 01:19 AM.
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