I've read here that wild caught fish like gar will startle when the lights are first turned on and rush headlong into the glass, breaking their neck. Example: http://forum.nanfa.o...on-gar-problem/
Is there a way to turn lights gradually on and off? I have been trying to figure this out and can't come up with anything better than using multiple lights and putting them on a timer to turn off one by one.
But there has to be a better way. Does anyone know of any equipment that could gradually turn a light on or off? Someone on another forum mentioned solenoids but it's been a few years since Circuits class and I don't remember enough to wire up a custom circuit by myself.
Gradual lights to prevent headlong rush into wall?
Started by
Guest_EricaWieser_*
, Apr 15 2013 08:37 PM
24 replies to this topic
#2
mattknepley
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Posted 15 April 2013 - 08:53 PM
For what it's worth, you might want to think outside the box, literally.
I think I remember reading about some people who wanted to create "natural" sunrises and sunsets in both fishrooms and frogrooms. Don't recall specifics, but it seems to me as though they eventually gave up on the idea of creating the solar events in each habitat, but went with the "whole room" concept. They put the room's lights on timers set to come on gradually to coincide with the season/environment they were trying to mimic. When the rooms were bright enough, those timers shut down and, in one case, the habitats then came on by timer, and in another the room lights were timed to stay on long enough for the owner to come in and check on his charges in the morning, at which point he simply turned the lights on themselves.
I think I remember reading about some people who wanted to create "natural" sunrises and sunsets in both fishrooms and frogrooms. Don't recall specifics, but it seems to me as though they eventually gave up on the idea of creating the solar events in each habitat, but went with the "whole room" concept. They put the room's lights on timers set to come on gradually to coincide with the season/environment they were trying to mimic. When the rooms were bright enough, those timers shut down and, in one case, the habitats then came on by timer, and in another the room lights were timed to stay on long enough for the owner to come in and check on his charges in the morning, at which point he simply turned the lights on themselves.
Matt Knepley
"No thanks, a third of a gopher would merely arouse my appetite..."
"No thanks, a third of a gopher would merely arouse my appetite..."
#3
Guest_rjmtx_*
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Posted 15 April 2013 - 10:37 PM
There are gradual light alarm clocks. Maybe coupling one of those with a overhead light on a timer would do the trick.
#4
Guest_Skipjack_*
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Posted 15 April 2013 - 10:59 PM
You cannot dim fluorescent tubes.
#5
Guest_Subrosa_*
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Posted 15 April 2013 - 11:26 PM
Wanna bet? Look into reef lighting. Dimmable T5HO set ups are available.You cannot dim fluorescent tubes.
Edited by Subrosa, 15 April 2013 - 11:32 PM.
#6
Guest_Skipjack_*
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Posted 15 April 2013 - 11:30 PM
Yep with alternative ballasts, probably not worth the cost.
#7
Guest_Skipjack_*
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Posted 15 April 2013 - 11:37 PM
Erica uses hardware store lights on her tanks to save money.
#8
Guest_Doug_Dame_*
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Posted 16 April 2013 - 12:46 AM
I have a tank directly in front of my desk at home, if I raise the focal point of my eyes 9 inches I'm staring into it. And my lights ... 4 tube hardware store fixture, something like Erica's ... are on a timer that abruptly cycles several times a day. (I've heard that 2 x 5 hr light periods is good for regular plants, but not good for algae. So that's what I'm doing.)
By happenstance, I was looking directly at the tank a couple of hours ago when it cycled on. No fish darted, jumped, or in any way seemed startled. (OTOH, I was surprised that no fish were surprised.) There was some ambiant room light already, however. And as I'm writing this, it just cycled back off; again, no fishy anxiety observed. I have a mixed community of minnows and darters in this tank, and a small clump of floating val that I need to plant.
Avoiding gar or really nervous fish seems to be a good solution for this problem.
Some of the fancy (expensive) marine light controllers let you have one light or bank of lights turn on to start, then another turns on 30-60 minutes later, in a step-function approximation of dawn. Ditto for twilight. Only helps if you have at least two different sets of lights, of course. A second cheap $5 timer hooked to a couple of +/- 13w curly-compact flourescents (replacements for std 40w or 60w incandescents) might produce a good-enough twilight effect.
By happenstance, I was looking directly at the tank a couple of hours ago when it cycled on. No fish darted, jumped, or in any way seemed startled. (OTOH, I was surprised that no fish were surprised.) There was some ambiant room light already, however. And as I'm writing this, it just cycled back off; again, no fishy anxiety observed. I have a mixed community of minnows and darters in this tank, and a small clump of floating val that I need to plant.
Avoiding gar or really nervous fish seems to be a good solution for this problem.
Some of the fancy (expensive) marine light controllers let you have one light or bank of lights turn on to start, then another turns on 30-60 minutes later, in a step-function approximation of dawn. Ditto for twilight. Only helps if you have at least two different sets of lights, of course. A second cheap $5 timer hooked to a couple of +/- 13w curly-compact flourescents (replacements for std 40w or 60w incandescents) might produce a good-enough twilight effect.
#9
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Posted 16 April 2013 - 06:40 AM
Walmart and Pep Boys sell very inexpensive LEDs that are popular with reefers to use as moonlights. It's basically a roll of thick tape with LEDs on the front. They're intended for dressing up cars I think. They produce a dim blue light. Have you considered altering the time you run artificial lights to coincide with the natural photoperiod? My lights come on at 8 am and go off at 6pm. The first light my fish see every day is natural light. I do it more in the interest of spawning, but I suppose it might keep my Pickerel from getting a pug nose as well.
#10
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Posted 16 April 2013 - 07:23 AM
Well, I just had an idea regarding that gar topic, but I'm not sure whether or not to revive it, so I guess I'll just post it here, but why not use a the one inch version of the foam I use from Swiss Tropicals for the sides and then use two inch in the back for an HMF, and there you go, a gar safe haven with amazing filtration!
#11
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Posted 16 April 2013 - 07:37 AM
I have had no problem with abrupt light changes with either gar or pickerel, but they were started as 3 inch fish. I did have problems with a tank full of tilapia, until I stuck my arm in the water, with a cut on my hand, and realized that I had stray voltage from the hardware store light. Fixed the problem, and no issues.
#12
Guest_EricaWieser_*
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Posted 16 April 2013 - 06:39 PM
This is a very good point. I have a question. What say if I set my fluorescent tubes to turn off at 8 pm with a timer, and had an incandescent light set to turn on from noon to 9 pm. At 9 pm, would there be a way to slowly turn the incandescent light off with some sort of programmable dimmer switch?You cannot dim fluorescent tubes.
#13
Guest_EricaWieser_*
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Posted 16 April 2013 - 06:41 PM
You know, that is a very substantial advantage to the HMF filter. *nods* A foam or moss wall background and an HMF on each side, and that gar would be hard pressed to find a way to snap its neck.Well, I just had an idea regarding that gar topic, but I'm not sure whether or not to revive it, so I guess I'll just post it here, but why not use a the one inch version of the foam I use from Swiss Tropicals for the sides and then use two inch in the back for an HMF, and there you go, a gar safe haven with amazing filtration!
Edited by EricaWieser, 16 April 2013 - 06:45 PM.
#14
Guest_Skipjack_*
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Posted 16 April 2013 - 06:45 PM
Erica, Lutron might make a programmable dimmer that would work for this.
#15
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Posted 16 April 2013 - 06:49 PM
I do use multiple lights currently, and I have something sort of similar to the LED. I have an Odyssea 216 watt T5HO and a Walmart 32 watt T8. The lights are timed so that at noon all the lights are on. Near dusk, first two of the 54 watt T5HO bulbs get turned off by a timer. Then the other two get turned off. Next to go is the 32 watt T8. And that leaves only the four LED moonlights, which are built into the Odyssea fixture. It's sorta gradual but I don't know if it's enough to avoid startling and to accurately simulate dusk enough to induce spawning. Also I don't like using so many timers 'cause they mess up all the time. Occasionally a timer gets stuck. One time I happened to be out in the room with the tanks at 4 am (I'm usually asleep) and I jumped when all of a sudden one of the bright 108 watters popped on. Poor fishies. I only jumped where I was sitting, but I'm sure a gar would have responded by killing itself. If I could use less timers and more dimming I think that this 4 am timer-mistake sort of thing would happen less often. And it really is a dramatic change between one light being on and two, which startles me. I'm sure it's startling the fish, too.Walmart and Pep Boys sell very inexpensive LEDs that are popular with reefers to use as moonlights. It's basically a roll of thick tape with LEDs on the front. They're intended for dressing up cars I think. They produce a dim blue light. Have you considered altering the time you run artificial lights to coincide with the natural photoperiod? My lights come on at 8 am and go off at 6pm. The first light my fish see every day is natural light. I do it more in the interest of spawning, but I suppose it might keep my Pickerel from getting a pug nose as well.
Edited by EricaWieser, 16 April 2013 - 06:53 PM.
#16
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Posted 16 April 2013 - 06:50 PM
*googles!*Erica, Lutron might make a programmable dimmer that would work for this.
Edit: Do you have a link?
Edited by EricaWieser, 16 April 2013 - 06:51 PM.
#17
Guest_EricaWieser_*
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Posted 16 April 2013 - 06:54 PM
I am going to go change my timers right now to make that happen. It can't hurt.Have you considered altering the time you run artificial lights to coincide with the natural photoperiod? My lights come on at 8 am and go off at 6pm. The first light my fish see every day is natural light.
#18
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#19
Guest_EricaWieser_*
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Posted 19 April 2013 - 07:12 PM
Dear Erica,
Thank you for contacting Lutron Electronics. In order to dim a T5 HO lamp, you will have to have a Lutron or Advance Mark X dimmable ballast so we can provide a wall dimmer but the lights will not dim to off over a period of time. The only product that will be able to do timer, controlling dimming ballast and dim to off using fade time feature is the Grafik Eye QS but the whole package might cost you over $1000.
Any further questions, please call 1-800-523-9466 to speak with one of our Technical Support Representatives so we can go over this in more detail.
Sincerely,
Miguel
Engineer Technician
Lutron Electronics, Inc.
www.lutron.com
MN
A thousand dollars? Eh. Sponge walls and captive raising the fish from a young age might just be the most reasonable solutions.
Edited by EricaWieser, 19 April 2013 - 07:14 PM.
#20
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Posted 20 April 2013 - 11:27 AM
By the way, I replied by asking, "Do you have any product that could slowly dim off an incandescent light over the course of like a half hour?" That would work, too.
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