27 replies to this topic

[Beeker]

Total newbie to native fish.
I joined a few years ago because I fell in love with the gulf coast pygmy sunfish.
I haven't been able to find any for sale around here, so I have been waiting patiently.
Until I find my cuties, I have a 30 gallon sand bottom, planted tank but don't know what to stock it with.
I currently have some cardinal tetras and sparkling gouramis. They can be moved to another tank. Or, I can set up one of my 20 gallon long tanks to be native. OR, I can get another 30 gallon at the next $1 per gallon sale! I don't know if my better half would allow that. We'll see. I have severe MTS issues.

So, what stocking suggestions does anybody/everybody have for a a 20 gallon long tank and/or a 30 gallon tank?

If there needs to be a substrate change, just let me know. I have Fluorite or sand. I can do barebottom, or get some nice smooth rocks from a lake.
As for plants, I have Java Fern, Anubius Barteri, Anubias Nana, Wisteria and Cabomba. My Anacharis all melted and died. I guess the temperature is set a bit too high for that plant (75).

[Josh Blaylock]

1st question: Where are you located?

[Michael Wolfe]

if you already have live plants and a sand bottom substrate, there are a lot of fish that you could do in a 30 gallon tank. Location is an important consideration. I am a big fan of hyper-local native fishtanks. I have a 75 in the house that is all fish caught is a small stream behind a family members house. It's like "this is what it looks like in the local streams" whenever anyone asks me about them.

Have you ever gotten out into your local waters?

[Beeker]

I'm located in New England.

When I was a child, I'd tag along with my big brother to the brook in the backyard and watch him fish for minnows. We'd also play with the crayfish.
Now that I'm older, I've forgotten how to pick them up without getting pinched. How is that possible?!
I thought I was doing it right, but as an adult, there is no way to safely hold a crayfish???
But little child hands can somehow do it. Odd.
In the summer, when we'd vacation at the lake my brother would catch little sunfish.
That is all I remember.

More recently, my father in-law was an amazing fly-fisherman. He'd catch trout when nobody else could.

I'm not interested in keeping anything other than fish or maybe crayfish.
And no tank larger than 30 gallons.
(Sorry, my 75 gallon tank is for my pet goldfish. They are my buddies.)

[keepnatives]

Most Common - Hold between the thumb and first finger directly behind where the pinchers (claws) attach to the body.
Most Manly - Allow them to pinch your thumb or finger while pinching their claw in return until the weakest relents and lets go.
Most Athletic - Parry back and forth with the beast's uplifted attack ready claws until you are able to pinch each of its claws shut with the thumb and first finger of each hand

[Sean Phillips]

How about a few Enneacanthus Sunfish and some Swamp Darters.

[Beeker]

Keepnatives,
I guess it will depend on what mood I'm in. I'll try those methods, thank you. LOL.

Sean,
Those are pretty neat looking. I like the looks of those Swamp Darters.

Anyone,
Are there any native freshwater fish that make interesting sounds and are not overly timid?
I forgot to mention that I cannot have shy or timid fish. There is a drumset, although muted, in the same room.
If it does not get used, the goldfish get angry. They get bored easily.

[Beeker]

It says that Swamp Darters are native to New England, but when I look up the list of New England freshwater fish, they aren't on it.
Most of the fish are quite large. It looks like Shiners, Sunfish and Chubs are all I can look at.
I do like the looks of those Swamp Darters and I saw Pumpkinseeds in another thread that looked pretty cool.
If I'm allowed to look outside New England, as I mentioned before, those Pygmy Sunfish are awesome looking!
Any thoughts?

[kirby007]

i don't know the specific laws for your state but there are websites where you can purchase native fish I believe one is run by a member on this board but the name escapes me. I do know you can purchase the pygmy sunfish from it. I'll message you the link

[Matt DeLaVega]

http://www.jonahsaquarium.com/ Mark Binkley

http://www.zimmermansfish.com/ Brian Zimmerman

Both are from Ohio, and both are great guys. Mark has a bit more fish to choose from. Brians claim to fame is that almost all of his fish are captive bred.

It looks to me that you have a pretty nice small sunfish in your general area. I do not know the laws on collecting them, but Banded sunfish only grow to about 3-4 inches. Pretty good looking fish. Likes a planted tank.
 banded sunfish.gif   64.19KB   3 downloads

[Beeker]

That is a handsome fish.
Thank you for those links.

So far, I've narrowed the available lists from those two links down to these fish:

Golden Topminnow - Fundulus crysotus
Russetfin Topminnow - Fundulus escambiae
Blackchin Shiner - Notropis heterodon
Southern Redbelly Dace - Chrosomus erythrogaster
Least Killifish - Heterandria formosa
Gulf Coast Pygmy Sunfish - Elassoma gilberti
Banded Sunfish - Enneacanthus obesus

and the swamp darter, but it wasn't available on those websites.

Once I get more information, I will choose the final list from the one above unless anyone recommends other fish or removing fish from that list.

Are there any other recommendations for a 30 gallon community tank with calm water or adjustments to the list I have?
(I would have preferred to get the Rainbow Darter, but it needs a stronger current.)

I'm still looking around this website, but can are there any profiles that contain minimum tank size recommendations and temperament information for these fish?

Edited by Beeker, 14 January 2015 - 09:33 AM.

[Beeker]

I'd like to add tadpole madtom to the list but no longer see the edit option on the post.

Does anybody have any other fish or changes to my list?

[Sean Phillips]

Rainbow darters (while they appreciate flow) don't need it, I kept a pair of bows with a pair if greensides; a pair of swamps, and some non darter natives in a 20 tall planted tank with just a sponge filter for flow quite successfully.

I'm not as knowledgeable as people like Matt or Brian but I do put a good bit of effort into my youtube series about captive care for different native fish. So far I've done rainbow and Greenside darters, creek chubs, bluefin Killies, and the yellow bullhead.
Playlist link if you're interested: https://www.youtube....AX9mrOzA38v_RtC

[Beeker]

I like the darters.
They are really alert. I like how they follow the camera and watch you watch them.

[Josh Blaylock]

You should really think about adding a Cyprinella species. They embody what the word 'shiner' means. I love that genus.

Sent from my Nexus 5

[Matt DeLaVega]

I am with Sean, I would not hesitate to put rainbows in low flow aquariums. Many of the streams I find them in, get so low in the summer that the rainbows live in pools in the wild for a good portion of the year.

As far as the Elassoma go, they are a pretty short lived fish. I think they work best in a species only tank with breeding them in mind. It can be much smaller than a 30. A trio would do fine in a planted 10 gallon, or a ten gallon with hornwort floating in it. They will also have a tough time competing. We used to have a member, I can't seem to remember her name, but she had some very indepth threads about Elassoma with some very good info. I am sure you can find them if you search "Elassoma gilberti"

Kind of the same story with H. formosa. Heck, you could keep a nice breeding colony in a hornwort filled 10 gallon. Really even a 5 gallon would work if you kept the population thinned down.

[Matt DeLaVega]

Oh Tadpole madtoms. As they start to get bigger, smaller fish may start disappearing over night.

Also to try to answer your last question. It does not seem that many people here keep fish by formulas. More by feel. But generally you could work off of formulas that are for similar sized tropical fish. I am a fan of great filtration, frequent water changes or lots of hornwort, and heavily stocked tanks. Everyone has their own preferences.

[Beeker]

I spoke to her when I first joined. I can't remember her name either.
I was hoping to find her again.
I won't do anything about the Ellasoma until I speak to her again.

Ok, you've convinced me. The tadpole madtoms are definitely out.
The rainbows are in!

The rest of the list is very difficult.
Still looking for info and advice.

[Sean Phillips]

As far as the Elassoma go, they are a pretty short lived fish. I think they work best in a species only tank with breeding them in mind. It can be much smaller than a 30. A trio would do fine in a planted 10 gallon, or a ten gallon with hornwort floating in it. They will also have a tough time competing. We used to have a member, I can't seem to remember her name, but she had some very indepth threads about Elassoma with some very good info. I am sure you can find them if you search "Elassoma gilberti"

Would that be Erica? Or someone else?

[Matt DeLaVega]

Yes! That was her name. Erica Wieser.