Any Idea What This Is?

Any idea what this is on the tail of this fish, and what (if anything) should be done about it?

The fish won't sit still for me to take a better picture of it; the fins are constantly vibrating. But it is kind of fuzzy and stringy. It started to show up just after a tank cleaning and water change. I forgot to salt the tank, then noticed this the next day, and added the usual tablespoon per five gallons at that time. I don't know if that's related. That was last weekend. The pictures were taken minutes ago.

 Pickerel_with_Stuff_on_Tail.jpg   116.81KB   8 downloads

 Tail_Closeup.jpg   50.17KB   4 downloads

Is the pickerel housed alone?

Looks to me like the dreaded Flexibacter, aka Columnaris, Flavobacter, mouth "fungus", tail rot, ...
Its a bacteria, not a fungus. while its just on fins you have a chance of curing it, but if it spreads into the body or gills then it kills very quickly. Salt and furan-based antibiotics sometimes work.

Looks to me like the dreaded Flexibacter, aka Columnaris, Flavobacter, mouth "fungus", tail rot, ...
Its a bacteria, not a fungus. while its just on fins you have a chance of curing it, but if it spreads into the body or gills then it kills very quickly. Salt and furan-based antibiotics sometimes work.

I was afraid of something like that. And I was afraid it was from forgetting the salt. How many tablespoons of salt per gallon for a salt dip, and how long to dip, please?

What else is with the pickerel?

Can you bump up the dose of salt to two Tablespoons per gallon right now? (do you have any catfish in the tank)?
Do you own melafix??? (I know it doesn't help much but usually doesn't hurt much either)

How big was the last water change and when and how big was the previous water change? What can you tell me about your water parameters?

What else is with the pickerel?

Pirate Perch.

Can you bump up the dose of salt to two Tablespoons per gallon right now? (do you have any catfish in the tank)?

I see no reason why not; there are no catfish in there. Will that harm java moss or moss balls? Or should they be removed?

Do you own melafix???

Never heard of it.

How big was the last water change and when and how big was the previous water change?

The tank was completely drained and the glass scrubbed last Sunday. The gravel was vacuumed, but left in the tank the whole time. The OTB filter was rinsed. The tank was re-filled with dechlorinated tap water, the OTB restarted, and the fish returned. You might say it has been spring cleaning time around here. It was as major of a cleaning as you get, short of a complete tank teardown. On Monday I realized I forgot the salt, and added it then. I did multiple tanks that day, and have only had a problem with this one.

I did other tanks yesterday. The sunfish are watching me type this through their nice clean glass.

What can you tell me about your water parameters?

Not much at this time. Neutral pH. I need to replace my spent test kits. Looks clean, smells clean, water is only a week old, tank is underpopulated. I'm not concerned about water quality. I suspected it had to do with my forgetting the salt. But as far as salt dips are concerned, I've never seen clear instructions on how to do it. It's always "mix it to 12 ppm" or whatever, I have no idea how to make such a concentration. I'm an engineer, not a chemist. I was really hoping for a recipe, and you gave me that, thanks. Two tablespoons per gallon. Gotcha.

Pirate Perch.
I see no reason why not; there are no catfish in there. Will that harm java moss or moss balls? Or should they be removed?
Never heard of it.
The tank was completely drained and the glass scrubbed last Sunday. The gravel was vacuumed, but left in the tank the whole time. The OTB filter was rinsed. The tank was re-filled with dechlorinated tap water, the OTB restarted, and the fish returned. You might say it has been spring cleaning time around here. It was as major of a cleaning as you get, short of a complete tank teardown. On Monday I realized I forgot the salt, and added it then. I did multiple tanks that day, and have only had a problem with this one.

I did other tanks yesterday. The sunfish are watching me type this through their nice clean glass.
Not much at this time. Neutral pH. I need to replace my spent test kits. Looks clean, smells clean, water is only a week old, tank is underpopulated. I'm not concerned about water quality. I suspected it had to do with my forgetting the salt. But as far as salt dips are concerned, I've never seen clear instructions on how to do it. It's always "mix it to 12 ppm" or whatever, I have no idea how to make such a concentration. I'm an engineer, not a chemist. I was really hoping for a recipe, and you gave me that, thanks. Two tablespoons per gallon. Gotcha.

This must just be the season for fungus. My girlfriend had an eerily similar problem recently - fungus broke out in her tank _right after a water change_. I couldn't figure it out.

Travis

Melafix is a tea tree oil based aquarium treatment that's pretty common in pet stores these days. I think it's a fairly new product (tea tree oil itself has obviously been around for a long time - in lotions, etc.). I'll agree that its helpfulness seems to be rather limited.

Ed,

Get your salt levels up fast. 2 tbsp per 5 gallons usually will not shock most fish, I'd get to that level right away.

The tank was completely drained and the glass scrubbed last Sunday. The gravel was vacuumed, but left in the tank the whole time. The OTB filter was rinsed.

I would advise you get an ammonia test kit yesterday! I suspect you might have disrupted your cycle when you drained all of the water, scrubbed the glass and rinsed the filter. Next time only do one of these things a week to avoid such issues.

I could be wrong and you can find out by testing your water for ammonia. If you have any ammonia present, you disrupted the cycle and need to let us know for further action. This can actually be a tricky thing to overcome.

Melafix isn't magic, usually will not cure but might very well prevent this from spreading if the cycle has been disturbed.

Good luck.

...Will that harm java moss or moss balls? Or should they be removed?

I don't think the salt would harm the plants, but any antibiotics will definitely harm the "moss balls", as I'm pretty sure they are a cyanobacteria. If you use an antibiotic, take them out until the antibiotics are removed.

For treating the fish, the only thing I've gotten to work on columnaris is Maracyn Plus.

Ed,

Get your salt levels up fast. 2 tbsp per 5 gallons usually will not shock most fish, I'd get to that level right away.
I would advise you get an ammonia test kit yesterday! I suspect you might have disrupted your cycle when you drained all of the water, scrubbed the glass and rinsed the filter. Next time only do one of these things a week to avoid such issues.

I could be wrong and you can find out by testing your water for ammonia. If you have any ammonia present, you disrupted the cycle and need to let us know for further action. This can actually be a tricky thing to overcome.

Melafix isn't magic, usually will not cure but might very well prevent this from spreading if the cycle has been disturbed.

Good luck.

Did you say 2 tbsp per gallon, or 2 tbsp per 5 gallons? Earlier you wrote 2 per gallon. Which is right?

The salt level in the tank is now at 2 tbsp per 5 gallons. Ammonia test reveals NO AMMONIA present in the water. I'll leave it like this for a day or two unless you recommend more salt, and report on progress.

Did you say 2 tbsp per gallon, or 2 tbsp per 5 gallons? Earlier you wrote 2 per gallon. Which is right?

The salt level in the tank is now at 2 tbsp per 5 gallons. Ammonia test reveals NO AMMONIA present in the water. I'll leave it like this for a day or two unless you recommend more salt, and report on progress.

I'm quite sorry Ed. I'm notorious for this very mistake. I should have said 2 TBS per 5 gallons.

2 TBS per 5 gallons should be fine for now. You can carefully bump that content up a very little (not quite to 3 TBS per 5 gallons) but not right away.

I was a little nervous about advising the use of Maracyn Plus with the potential bio filter issue. It's certainly more effective than Melafix but make sure and use Maracyn Plus not an equal if you decide to go that route. Only use this product if you feel confident of your bio filters health. They say it will not effect the biofilter but I'm a doubting Thomas. You should really consider isolation when using heavy duty anti biotic. Do you have QT or hospital tank you can place the fish in while treating?

How does the fish look today?

Not to poke but was there a good reason to drain an entire tank. I hope the fish cures. Is it the red fin strain? I know you probably have it posted up there but I cannot see it right now. Let me know how it does. I think it will survive but may take a while to repair the fin. My suggestion is to never drain an entire tank. I would only do so if there was some dread disease that I had to get rid of and that was the only alternative. How is the SB doing??

Not to poke but was there a good reason to drain an entire tank. I hope the fish cures. Is it the red fin strain? I know you probably have it posted up there but I cannot see it right now. Let me know how it does. I think it will survive but may take a while to repair the fin. My suggestion is to never drain an entire tank. I would only do so if there was some dread disease that I had to get rid of and that was the only alternative. How is the SB doing??

No, I didn't explicitly state it, I thought it was obvious from the photo that it's a redfin. The extra salt did not seem to be helping, so I put it in an aerated 5-gallon bucket with 3 tablespoons of salt and some Binox.

The Binox worked on my grass pickerel. When I first brought it home, until I bought a tank for it, I kept it with some darters. Believe it or not, the darters fin-nipped the grass pickerel pretty badly. I did not expect that at all. The pickerels are so mild-mannered, non-aggressive, that when they are small (3") they can be picked on by darters. It didn't stay with the darters for long at all before I bought it a tank, but the darters ate big chunks out of the dorsal, caudal, and pectoral fins. The dorsal and caudal have grown back, but the pecs are still tiny. Anyway, fin rot ensued, and I put Binox in the tank with it, and within a few days the fin rot was gone. That was last October, and the grass pickerel has been fine since. He's big enough now to regard darters as food, indeed, I fed him some Johnny's from a place nearby where I netted scores of them, along with hundreds of juvenile creek chubs. Back then, darters were not food, I fed him guppies mainly.

The growth pattern of the "fungus" on the redfin did not match the growth pattern that the grass pickerel had before, so I did not recognize it as the same problem. But maybe that is because of the nature of the injuries the "fungus" was attacking on the grass pickerel. The redfin had no injuries that I was aware of. However, since they do get paranoid and dart around the tank sometimes, especially when I turn the light on or approach the tank apparently unexpectedly, it may have become vulnerable to fin rot by scraping a rock or the filter intake tube. It's hard to say, but I think the Binox will work.

I understand what you are saying about tank cleanings, but sometimes a tank just needs a good scrub down. And sometimes you need to move a tank. And you can't move it when it's full of water. I moved this one. I have never had a problem doing this before. I feel pretty confident this will work out in the end. I intend to empty out the feeder tank and use it as a hospital tank for a few days until the pickerel is healed.

If, by SB, you mean the shadow bass you sent me, it is doing fine. The spot it had on its side when it arrived, where the scales appeared to be missing, has almost completely filled back in with scales, and its pattern is restored accordingly. I think in a few more days it will be completely filled in. Since you say it was like that when you caught it, there's no telling how it happened, but it's healing quite nicely. It has taken over the hiding spot the warmouth was originally using. The warmouth is now hiding amongst the rocks, and spending more time in the open water. All is well and good for them.

I do not recall saying that it had that " but my memory is bad " ( the shadow bass scale damage ) when I caught it. I talked about having it in a tank with other sunnies but never saw them bully him. And about the color of the fins on the grass pickerel, I said in my post that you probably mentioned it but I cannot see it while typing this message. I had not looked at the photo very well when I posted that message.

I am glad to hear that the Shadow bass is doing well. He is a very nice one. I will get another. Maybe I will fish there with rod and reel now to see If I can get one big enough for my large tank and its inhabitants. And you mentioned to me in a PM about changing my mind. Well I was out fishing the other day and caught this unsuall warmouth. It was black, "very black" with silver bars. The bottom fins were bordered with wide margins of white. His dosal is so high and reaches far back and is very very rounded and the color in it, well the point is it looks as though it is a crappie warmouth hybrid. I do not think that is what is is, but he is just an unusual one and looks like that. Well long story short point, he is in my tank. So if you want to ship that pumpkinseed I will graciously recieve it. I will just spring for a new tank I think when the Blue spots start to get to large for the grow out tank. I will still be departing with one pickerel when the fellow can meet up with me. I want more tank space for sunnies so I will just keep one grass pickerel.

How is the healing process comming. Hope this beauty makes a 100% comeback.

Here is the fish Sunday, after three days in the Binox bath:

 P4150018_Well_Pickerel.jpg   42.31KB   1 downloads

It has white bucket syndrome, but other than that, it looks good. It is back in its tank. The salt level remains at two tablespoons per five gallons for now. I'm going to leave it in stable conditions for a while before attempting to do a partial water change and get the salt level down to the normal one tablespoon per five gallons.

The fish is looking much better Ed and sounds like you have a good plan to get the tank back into it's normal routine. I'm glad he pulled through.

I have had success with melafix healing fins and sores but that is it.

Glad to hear you redfin is doing OK. I know you love those pickerels. I may in the future get one but for now since I have orange spots, blue spots and I have a dollar sunfish in another tank I am going to be a sunfish man. I want to head back to louisiana again to collect some more banded pygmies down there. It is like taking candy from a baby they are so neumerous down there. But as I learned from the last trip down I will not transport thim with pirate perch or baby warmouths. I also want to try again to locate some dollars. The one I was given sparkles like a polished diamond. Blue fins on the bottom and blue spots on the body with a darker color beneath. Orangish chest and belly color. And the lines on the cheeks are so blue. Now that I have actually seen how beautiful dollars are I want a species tank of just those. I was given a twenty long with heater and hood yesterday. So I now have more room to manuver around. I definatly like the dwarf sunfishes if that is how one would describe them. I am not up on all these scientific terms. But all I can say again is that dollar sunfish exceeds all my expectations on how beautiful they are. I would try to get a photo but he retreats as soon as you approach to close. And if you took it out it would just blush its color away.

Well I got a pic of him on Sunday.