7 replies to this topic

[TownForkCreek]

New to this group so please bear with me. In July, 2012, my husband and I were using a small net in our shallow creek (Town Fork Creek, southern Stokes County NC) to collect interesting critters for a small aquarium. I had previously kept SA tropicals. We caught some minnows, a couple of crayfish and a 2" odd hatchling who turned out to be a Marginated Madtom. Fast forward to present day. The madtom is a robust 8" fish who shares a 30 gallon tank with a mature Festivum (8") and a gold gourami (4"). Unlikely tankmates, I know, but the madtom is just so cool. I'll admit he's snacked on a few smaller fish through the years.

 

About six weeks ago the Festivum (a SA cichlid) developed a couple of small (2 mm) round cyst-like nodules between the rays of his tail fin. I kept an eye on him, but didn't observe any changes - until yesterday morning when I noticed half a dozen white, pimple or worm-like protrusions on his head. I first checked my resourced for tropical fish diseases and parasites and nothing quite fit. Then, doing an image search, I found pics of 'yellow grubs' in FW native fish that really looked like what we have. My research indicates that the parasite is transmitted via fish-eating birds (we have herons).

 

My question: could this parasite have remained dormant in the madtom all this time and jumped species only to emerge under stress? (I was hospitalized and couldn't do my regular water change for a couple weeks) Is it treatable and if so, how? The first photo is of the Festivum's head, the second of "Tom".

Attached Images

• 
• 

[loopsnj64]

Its possible, but i have had native fish catch diseases from tropicals and oddly enough, not the other way around

[gerald]

No I dont think it's possible - yellow grub flukes don't transfer from fish to fish.  The infected fish must be eaten by a bird (where the fluke matures), the bird must poop in water for the 1st stage larvae to infect an aquatic snail, and then the 2nd stage larvae transfer from snail to fish.  Without the bird, the cycle is broken.  You can however, get yellow grubs in fish by bringing in infected wild snails collected from streams or ponds where herons have pooped. 

 

Also, the nodules on your festivum do not look like yellow grubs, which are usually encysted in muscle or fin tissue under the skin.   I think that's more likely a bacterial infection in the head pores, similar to hole-in-head that old fish often get.  Frequent water changes and diet diversification might help (earthworms, mealworms, zucchini, greens, sweet potato, peas ...)

 

Town Fork Creek has some nice fish - that was one of our destinations in 2007 when the NANFA Convention was in Greensboro.

[Betta132]

You probably need to do a lot of water changes, and check for aggression- an 8" fish in a 30g is probably going to be feeling very cramped, and cramped fish sometimes lash out.

[TownForkCreek]

Thanks, Gerald. I had considered hole-in-the-head disease as a possibility, but the photos I found online just looked really different. I'll get really vigilant about water quality and diversify foods. Have begun general anti-fungal/bacterial treatment with Pimafix & Melafix (Api).

 

Yes, our stretch of Town Fork Creek has a lot of interesting fish and other critters. It's shallower now, since a stupid neighbor cut his riparian barrier to enlarge a field, resulting in a lot of silt and erosion. But that's Nature, ever changing and adapting. Shallow is just fine with Madtoms  

[gerald]

Hole-in-the head is a symptom of many different "diseases" - some infectious, some water quality-related or diet-related, so don't be surprised to find lots of pictures of pitted heads that look very different.  Hexamita is sometimes found in these head pits, but my guess is that's a secondary invader and not the real cause.   I have seen other cichlids develop white to yellowish bumps in the head pores like your festivum (and 8" is a huge festivum!) -- sometimes it progresses to gaping sores and death, sometimes it heals up OK.  Again, the possible causes are many - it's not just one disease. 

 

High nitrate has also been implicated as a possible cause -- you might want to add some fast-growing floating plants like frogbit (Limnobium) to remove nitrate.  The only plants I see in your photos look plastic.  Somebody in the Triad Aquarists can probably give you some (they meet 1st Fridays at WFU) or if not there will be plenty of frogbit, hornwort, etc at the Raleigh Aquar Soc auction on Nov 15 (state fairground).

[TownForkCreek]

Thanks! I'll definitely go plant seeking. This morning the worm-like things, which had been partially visible beneath the skin, were gone and there were sores instead. I don't know if that's good or bad. Continuing to treat with the API Pimafix and Melafix and monitoring water quality. 

 

Re: the 'giant' festivum, he's easily 1/3 bigger than the previous one I had. Three years old and fully the size of my hand from wrist to finger tip. A very personable fish, so I want to do all I can to help him recover.

[Betta132]

Is a larger tank a possibility? A 30g with an 8" catfish, an 8" cichlid, and a 4" gourami sounds possibly overstocked, and that might be an issue.