49 replies to this topic

[9darlingcalvi]

I know this is mostly fish a fish forum, but i'm throwing in my paludarium project here. The tank is a 26 bow front, and will house 3-5 Western or Boreal chorus frogs, maybe a couple johnny darters and for sure ghost shrimp. The land will have 3 buttress trees made of insulation board painted in dry lock and acrylic. The reaming background will be great-stuff painted like the trees. There will be a false bottom filled with leca for filtration and a pump surrounded by a sponge for even more filtration, the will be a compartment with a lid to get to the pump. The banks will be carved great stuff with a few small holes to let water into the pump area. The substrate will be ABG with leaf litter on top, for plants there will be a native ivy and grass species.   IMG_0180.JPG   38.8KB   13 downloads  IMG_0186.JPG   34.49KB   12 downloads

[Josh Blaylock]

I hope you do a detailed post of the build up of this.  I've been wanting to do a 40-breeder paludarium for years, with native fish and salamanders.

[9darlingcalvi]

I'm thinking of doing american toads, they are bigger and eat better for me. Although the chorus would be coll to have they dont eat for me...

[Chasmodes]

American toads are an excellent choice.  I've had good luck keeping gray tree frogs too.  

 

In addition, spotted, marbled and northern red salamanders make for excellent inhabitants.  They love to eat any insects that you find and devour earthworms.  They'll hide in their caves until they see you coming.  Then, they'll appear looking for any handouts that you have ready for them.

 

A note on the salamanders, they are cannibalistic.  Make sure that they ones you keep are roughly the same size.  If you mix species, make sure the marbles are bigger than the spotted, or too fat for the spotted's mouth, otherwise they'll be food.

 

Good luck with your tank.  I'll look forward to the next updates and progress.

[9darlingcalvi]

Oaky, so we dont have salamanders where I live, I might do wood frogs...or maybe try and find a tiger salamander by my friends maple syrup farm. I got some small oak trees, they have cool root balls and small trunks, im thinking about having them along the water edge and use my grasses near the edge as weel. Might add some ferns in the back with a nice log covered in moss and leaves, hopefully getting the false bottom supplies soon.

[9darlingcalvi]

So now the decision of a spotted, marbled or tiger salamander. I'm  drawn to the spotted as its like the tiger and marbled mixed. Its smaller so it wont destroy the tank as much and has nice colors. I do like the sizer of the tiger, but fear it destroying the tank. My other options are wood frogs or western chorus frogs

[9darlingcalvi]

Okay, final 2 choices: Blue spotted salamander (Ambystoma laterale) or Eastern tiger salamander (Ambystoma tigrinum)

[9darlingcalvi]

heres a mock up of what I hope it will look like, I'll make the banks great stuff covered in the mix, also ill make the land a great stuff "shell" and put around 3-4" of dirt over it. I will also just put ferns with leaf litter and moss, the pond will have johnny darters, ghost shrimp and maybe shiners or other minnows. I dont care if the fish get eaten, also last the tank will be home to a couple blue spots or ill bu them. They arent on the lacey act ban so it would be fine.  IMG_0210.JPG   41.91KB   8 downloads  IMG_0211.JPG   43.73KB   9 downloads  IMG_0212.JPG   33.75KB   8 downloads  IMG_0213.JPG   50.88KB   8 downloads

[9darlingcalvi]

instead of making a retaining wall I'm going to take insulation foam boards and make lots of caves and tunnels. 

[9darlingcalvi]

here is the big question, what would be a more interactive and personable sal? Blue spotted or Tiger?

[Chasmodes]

Looking good!

 

I've never kept either because they're protected where I live.  I'd imagine that both would be equally personable once they identify you as their food source. 

[9darlingcalvi]

The last main Q is could i get 2 tigers in there, I was thinking just one but maybe a second on? Here's my cave planing and overall layout, The front will have one big cave that has tow exit holes, the left side will have noting but the back will have a dome with entrance hole, the left side will have  cave and tree above it with roots coming down. The main floor space will have a shallow water bowl, fake log hide and 3 spots for ferns. all the caves will have a mix of 2 parts coir to 1 part peat siliconed to them and a layer of lose dirt under the arch cave and log cave, in the other caves moss will line the bottom. In total there are 6 hides. The top level will have an inch of dirt, leaves and moss patches.   IMG_0218.JPG   60.89KB   7 downloads

[MtFallsTodd]

Looks like a good plan, looking forward to seeing it finished.

[9darlingcalvi]

Hopefully it will start on Thursday, it will have 3 layers of syrofoam


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[9darlingcalvi]

And I probably will have 2 tigers


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Chasmodes]

Make sure that the two salamanders are about the same size otherwise you'll wind up with one big fat one!

 

I kept my salamanders with just a gravel pool and slate stacked from the bottom of the tank up resembling layers and created caves.  I used a cheap submersible pump and bury it in the gravel under the slate and it would pump water above the slate and create a nice artificial spring.  I had about 4" of gravel sloped to the back around the slate.  If I had to do that all over again, I would have used something to glue the slate pieces together for stability and probably create a foam background...maybe attempt to keep fish too somehow.  

 

Your salamanders will find a favorite cave and hang out there most of the time with their heads sticking out.  When they sense you coming (food), they'll crawl out half way or maybe all the way out.  I used to dangle earthworms and they'd come out and eat from my hand (after they get used to you).  After a good rainy day, collecting worms from sidewalks for my tank was part of the fun, and a feast for my critters.

 

As with frogs, salamanders can leave a tank messy, so that might be something to consider with your build, how to keep it clean.  I'd pull out the slate and wash the gravel now and then.  I didn't keep fish in that tank, so I didn't have to worry about water quality.  I've never tried what you're doing, so I can't help you with how to do that.  I can't wait to see how your tank turns out.

[9darlingcalvi]

I am putting lids on all the hides, my water area won't be that deep and I'll have to change it out every other day. So you're saying that I don't need all of these caves?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[9darlingcalvi]

Also I might close off one of the caves and put a grass spider or other cool microcritter. I would block it off so the salamander couldn't get in


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[9darlingcalvi]

Okay, so my new idea was connecting all the viewable tunnels and maybe have a marbled salamander living there? I would have air holes and a feeding door forbit


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Chasmodes]

I am putting lids on all the hides, my water area won't be that deep and I'll have to change it out every other day. So you're saying that I don't need all of these caves?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Naw, I'm not saying that.  The salamanders may move between them no matter how many you have.  I had far more caves in my tank than I had salamanders.  They may use their "favorites" more than the others, but who knows why.  I doubt that they even know.  They may hang out in a cave for a long time, then all of a sudden, you'll spot them in a cave that they haven't been using and maybe it will hang there for a while, then go back.  There may be other times that they'll both be in the same cave, LOL.

 

Sometimes they seem to disappear.  When I saw that with my tank, my fear was that one was eaten, so I'd do an emergency search.  Sure enough, I'd pull out all the rocks, and under one of the rocks in a place that I'd least suspect, would be a salamander there.  I'd take those times to clean and rebuild.  

 

I think that you should build the tank the way that you envision it, because in the end, you are the one that needs to be happy with it.  The salamanders will benefit from your care and be perfectly happy as long as they have places to hide and are provided with good food and water.  I think your plan is a good one as is.  

 

One more tip though, make sure that you have a good lid that keeps them from escaping.  They can climb the glass and get out.  I left the top off one day after cleaning to go out to dinner.  I came home and one was crawling around in our kitchen, almost dried out.  I returned it to the tank and once it was hydrated, was OK again.