Who here has experience with restoration?

One simple way is to put them in a ziplock bag and photograph them like that. It's not the greatest, but it'll work fairly well.

If you'd like to take it to another level... My man Uland (teleost) has it down. Search for some of the photography threads. You'll see a lot of the work people have been doing in the ID section with the paddle tanks.

In fact, y'all are close enough, that you might try and talk him into showing you the ropes There's some pretty stuff down there on that Kankakee once this water gets out of here.

Todd

No shortage of ziplocks around here. I used one to photograph a pleco I needed to temporarily add to a pond to control algae over the summer. Photos didn't turn out the best but I could see that as doable if I had someone hold up the bag as opposed to me holding the bag in one hand while taking the picture with the other.

Yes, I've seen teleost's photos. Very nice.

It is my intent to tag along on one of his outings this coming year.

editing to add- pleco was added to a small pre-form pond used as a nursery for aquatic plants. Pleco was removed at end of season.

Lorax,
A couple of members were kind enough to direct me to an partnership in Ohio between ODNR and The Nature Conservancy. They deal in everything related to vernal pools. I wasn't sure if you were looking to have ponds, a permanent wetland, vernal pools, or a combination. This may not be exactly what you're looking for, but they may have some helpful hints. Here's a link to a sight in which they describe a vernal pool restoration project.
http://ovpp.org/protection.html

Hope it is helpful,
Thom

Edit: (also here) http://ovpp.org/ecoinfo.html

Gotta love The Nature Conservancy.

Particularly enjoyed the material at your last link. Thank you very kindly for providing those links.

Gotta love The Nature Conservancy.

Particularly enjoyed the material at your last link. Thank you very kindly for providing those links.

Lorax,
I apologize for being late to the thread. Haven't checked the forum in a bit. It sounds like you are squared away and the input from others is spot on. Todd hit it on the head with the NRCS and potential WRP program. I am biologist with the Corps (mostly NY, some OH), if you want to chat give me a call (716)879-4325 work.
-Scott

Hello sschluet,

No need to apologize in the least. It's not like my mess over here is going anywhere anytime soon. It will all be there waiting for me tomorrow and the day after and the day after that and it's not as if we aren't all busy people with lots on our plates.

Thank you for offering me contact information. More appreciative than you may understand. When is the best time to call you? I have attempted to contact you a few times but refrained from leaving a message. Felt sort of silly leaving a message something to the effect of, "Hi, I'm TheLorax. Please call me when you get a spare moment" on your work phone.

That isn't going to bother Scott. He may not see the post here either... When he gets busy, he is BUSY. I'd call and leave a message so he can get back to you when he has a chance.

Todd

Hi Todd (Lorax waves)!

I was lucky enough to reach him and he was able to view an aerial of my land while we spoke. I think he's got a pretty darn good idea of what I'm up against. I've got trouble but I'm still going for it even though the odds are against me. I want my ponds back and I want all the lifeforms back that were once present in that wetlands.

Speaking of aerial views, the most recent view would have a decent sized greenhouse right next to a detached 1.5 story mini looking house deal out back that I use for storage as well as for a potting shed. If compared to aerial views taken just 5 years ago, one can see how virtually the entire uplands has been cleared of around 90% of the invasive species. Really opened up the understory and the improvement is definitely visible from an aerial view. I'm very pleased with how far I've gotten by myself but now it is time to begin focusing on the wetlands. I have my snowshoes and mother's day is right around the corner and that's when I will receive my new wetlands toy!

mother's day is right around the corner and that's when I will receive my new wetlands toy!

What was that again? A flamethrower or something like that...?

There is a great company based out of Indiana that specializes in native plants. They have native plant nurseries and you can order anything you need. They will do some research into what is native to your area to make sure that you are getting what you need. They do wetlands, lakes, ponds, praries.

The company is JF New (http://www.jfnew.com/). I have worked with them and they are very knowledgable, and have great ethics

You may also want to contact your county soil & water conservation district (SWCD). They may have information on soil types or help you do some quick checks on soil types.

Be careful with SWCD's, You will definately have to ask questions to see if they know what they are talking about (similar to those you and other have discussed here) for help beyond the soils. Some SWCD's are tilers and ditchers. and it seems there main goal is to drain and till. Others will have a more balanced approach and have a great deal of knowledge and willingness to help.

Just a few pointers.

On the note of buying seed/stock, there are a lot of native seed suppliers in the midwest, especially for prairie work, but they'll have wetland stuff too. A quick scan of the back of an Ecological Restoration issue yields the Indiana nursuries:
Spence Restoration Nursery: www.spencenursery.com
JFNew: www.jfnew.com

(I have no experience with these two companies though, as their seed isn't appropriate for the southeast)

A lot of people use Earnst Conservation Seeds, out of Pennsylvania.

Also, I don't know if you've been to the Indiana Native Plant Society's website: http://www.inpaws.org/ They will likely have a list of native plant sources.

Anyway, my point for adding this was that if you go to the website or get the catalog for these companies, sometimes they have advice on how to go about restorations. A nice thing about the Illinois companies would be that they might have advice that is specifically taylored to your area. If you google something like "Illinois native plant seed", I'm sure more companies will come up.

(Also, if you need material to keep the soil from washing out as your plants get established, or other such stuff, I often specify material from North American Green, and erosion control company www.nagreen.com. They make some stuff that is completely biodegradable. They also give good instructions! Depending on your conditions, (slopes?) you may not need stuff like this. I just thought I'd mention it.)

Oh my gosh, I am not ignoring any of you. For some reason I am not receiving notifications of replies to any threads or private messages. I am so sorry. Must be that the wonderful new filters put in place by my ISP a few months ago are deeming NANFA to be spam while the offers for look alike Gucci purses and Viagra keep rolling in.

I should be ok on native plant material. Preference is for local native genotype and I'll try my best for the nurseries that propagate that genotype first before striking out to other native plant nurseries. I have ordered from JF New before and they were a pleasure to deal with.

North American Green looks interesting. I will check them out.

Silly you Irate Mormon, not a flame thrower or anything fun like that but I do have a propane torch complete with the 100,000 BTU Deluxe Vapor Kit. Does my "Weed Dragon" count for anything?
http://www.flameengi...eed_Dragon.html
The new toy I'm getting is either the Stihl FS550 or the FS350. It's a heavy brush cutter! It will depend on what deals are out there when he goes to buy.

Why yes, My County Storm Water Management Agency has some really interesting beliefs. How ever did you know this might be the case Scenicrivers? Personally, I'd prefer to be working with the Army Corps.

FYI people, Scott did say I was probably in trouble here based on what he's seeing. I knew I was in trouble. He's a herp biologist and is going to be checking some things out with his peers and getting back to me. Fire was discussed but that already bit the dust a while ago as a viable option. Flooding the area, which was his first suggestion, was actually my first thought over a year ago but most unfortunately no way to get that volume of water trucked in here for around 14 acres of infested wetlands. Next option discussed would have been desirable for a wetlands that's as degraded as mine however removing 2' won't fly with the Powers That Be given any material removed from a wetland must stay on the property and there's that other little issue about me only owning a portion of the wetlands. I would not be in a position to apply for permits for the portions of the wetlands they own and then there would be the not- so-little issue of where to go with all that phragmites debris and the seedbank embedded in it. Barring that, my neighbors think it's a beautiful wave of natural looking green ever since I provided them with some preliminary prices for restoration. That leaves me with one option which was to try to get it by myself when that little window of opportunity presents itself. There are a few weeks in the spring and a few weeks in the fall when the Phragmites is still in active growth and the natives are dormant. If I keep at it year after year after year after year... I might have a shot at this.

FYI people, Scott did say I was probably in trouble here based on what he's seeing. I knew I was in trouble. He's a herp biologist and is going to be checking some things out with his peers and getting back to me. Fire was discussed but that already bit the dust a while ago as a viable option. Flooding the area, which was his first suggestion, was actually my first thought over a year ago but most unfortunately no way to get that volume of water trucked in here for around 14 acres of infested wetlands. Next option discussed would have been desirable for a wetlands that's as degraded as mine however removing 2' won't fly with the Powers That Be given any material removed from a wetland must stay on the property and there's that other little issue about me only owning a portion of the wetlands. I would not be in a position to apply for permits for the portions of the wetlands they own and then there would be the not- so-little issue of where to go with all that phragmites debris and the seedbank embedded in it. Barring that, my neighbors think it's a beautiful wave of natural looking green ever since I provided them with some preliminary prices for restoration. That leaves me with one option which was to try to get it by myself when that little window of opportunity presents itself. There are a few weeks in the spring and a few weeks in the fall when the Phragmites is still in active growth and the natives are dormant. If I keep at it year after year after year after year... I might have a shot at this.

I sent you a PM. Based on site conditions, seems like the basic "clip and drip" method of treatment might be your best "fix" (w/ large amounts of elbow grease). Roughly 100 sq ft treated in 45 minutes, not a quick fix. Have seen this used succesfully in high quality natural areas with little collateral damage. In the scenario you outlined, you might be able to show other property owners around the pond the restoration potential by using your piece of the pie as an example. Keep up the fight.
-Scott
PS- primarily a fish guy, have done a few herp research projects

Does my "Weed Dragon" count for anything?

It has possibilities! Just needs a little more "There" there.

Hey Scott,

Oopsie on you being a herpie kinda guy instead of a fishie kinda guy! Makes no difference to me, you confirmed my sinking suspicions. My goal was to attempt for the least amount of collateral damage anyway so I'm really ok with this. It will probably take me a few years longer with clip and drip. Shelf life on the Accord is around 5 years so I should have enough time.

Back to square one, eh? Figures there would be no way to avoid excessive elbow grease but on the other hand fire really wasn't an option because of the biomass out there that might not stop burning for a few years. I'm ready, done got me snowshoes to be able to maneuver around out there! Am I stylin or what! Here's hoping I am able to stay up on them as well as I did in snow. Not exactly thrilled with your estimate of about 100 sq feet per 45 minutes given it can be sweltering out here in the Midwest and also given I'm a little bit slower and older these days but little strokes fell great oaks and all. I guess I should go and cancel out my health club membership, no need for that any more with what I'm going to be doing. Sheesh, I should maybe advertise to see if I can get any people who want an alternative to spending big bucks at a fat farm by allowing them to "work out" with me. Technical question for you or anyone else out there who may be in a position to answer, I'm going with Scott's suggestion of Accord as opposed to Rodeo or AquaMaster. I'm using Cide-Kick II as a surfactant as I'm most comfortable with that. That would be 6oz per gallon of water on the Accord plus 1.5oz of Cide-Kick II, right? If my dilutions are wrong, please correct me. I did also order a colorfast dye additive so I would be able to figure out where I left off.

I should really take some before pictures of the area I'm going to start working in and post them.

I've ordered from http://www.forestry-suppliers.com/ so don't anyone be breaking my heart by sharing any sources that were more affordable right about now.

Wish me luck folks, I want all of my ponds back some day and my muskrats too and well.... every other life form that was once here too.

Hey Irate Mormon,
Lemme guess... you've got more oomph power because you've got a commercial grade acetylene torch? I tried one of those and my husband took it away from me after I practiced a little bit out in the front lawn. The Weed Dragon is much easier to use because the tank is on wheels. That's about as much "There" there as I should have, wouldn't want to torch the whole front lawn again. Looked horrible for quite a while.

Hmmm... lots of elbow grease.... sounds like an Eagle Scout project to me! Got any troops handy?

In my dreams would I be able to get a bunch of Boy Scouts. I wouldn't feel uncomfortable letting them use a chemical though- it's the Mom in me. I don't allow my own kids use chemicals and glyphosate may be a lesser evil but it's still a cause for concern.

That 100 sq feet per 45 minutes is the material nightmares are made of. Hey nativeplanter, will you come visit me and play out in my yard?

Just bringing this up again-

I'm using Cide-Kick II as a surfactant as I'm most comfortable with that. That would be 6oz per gallon of water on the Accord plus 1.5oz of Cide-Kick II, right? If my dilutions are wrong, please correct me.