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Planning 75g native

Started by Guest_alter40_* , Feb 19 2008 09:46 AM

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17 replies to this topic

#1 Guest_alter40_*

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Posted 19 February 2008 - 09:46 AM

I'm new to keeping natives but I plan on starting up a new tank this spring, once all of the ice is gone, for natives. I'm not sure what type of smaller fish we have in this area but I will be setting up minnow traps and using a one man seine to scout things out as early as I can. I was hoping to keep 2 of the smallest yellow perch that I can find and maybe a couple of small rock bass as well. These are both fish that I'm positive that I will be able to easily catch. I don't know if I can find any bluegill or pumpkinseed, but if I do come across some small ones while using the minnow trap or the seine I would probably swap those out for the rock bass. I also plan on collecting some rocks, driftwood, and plants all out of my local waters. I'm not sure what I will use for my substrate yet but would like to find something the really makes the tank look natural.

Do these plans sound ok so far? 2 yellow perch, 2 rock bass, and I would probably put a bunch of minnows in there as well depending on what I am able to find.

As far as filtering goes, what is my best option for a native tank? I was thinking about setting it up with a canister filter but if something like the emperor 400 would be better for this then I can also go that route. If there is anything missing that I haven't mentioned please let me know.

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#2 Guest_fishlvr_*

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Posted 19 February 2008 - 11:33 AM

Welcome to the forum!

You need to check your local laws about collecting those fish, since rock bass, yellow perch, bluegill, and pseeds are considered gamefish in most states, and can only be collected by hook and line.

A couple of rock bass and a yellow perch sounds good for your tank, but the minnows will become lunch as soon as the rock bass get big enough to eat them.

Again, welcome to the forum!
-Steve

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#3 Guest_Gambusia_*

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Posted 19 February 2008 - 12:10 PM

The perch and rock bass will eat the minnows if the minnows are too small

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#4 Guest_Irate Mormon_*

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Posted 19 February 2008 - 12:11 PM

Minners would be OK for however long they don't get eaten. When planning these things you kind of have to decide whether you want piscivores or minners and darters. Or you can do like I do and just lump 'em all together, and declare the last fish standing your "pet", and give it a name like George or something. Then you just have an excuse to go out and seine more fish, and hope you don't bring home something that is meaner or hungrier than George is.

I'm hoping to get a gar this spring. I'm gonna go ahead and name him now.

For a tank that size I'm partial to canisters - less obtrusive.

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#5 Guest_alter40_*

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Posted 19 February 2008 - 01:38 PM

Welcome to the forum!

You need to check your local laws about collecting those fish, since rock bass, yellow perch, bluegill, and pseeds are considered gamefish in most states, and can only be collected by hook and line.

A couple of rock bass and a yellow perch sounds good for your tank, but the minnows will become lunch as soon as the rock bass get big enough to eat them.

Again, welcome to the forum!
-Steve

Thanks for the welcome.

The rock bass and perch were going to be caught with the hook and line and I know there is no min size requirements for these and the same goes for the bluegill or pseeds as well. I will have to see if I can catch a bluegill or pumpkinseed with a hook and line. I'm not sure of the laws with catching these with a net but I guess its probably not legal. Would a small bullhead work in a tank like this too?

With the minnows, I will try to get the largest ones I can find so they don't become lunch right away and I will also try to put some good places in there for them to hide in if I can. I doubt they will last long though from the sounds of it.

Would some native crays work in this tank as well?

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#6 Guest_fishlvr_*

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Posted 19 February 2008 - 01:47 PM

Thanks for the welcome.

The rock bass and perch were going to be caught with the hook and line and I know there is no min size requirements for these and the same goes for the bluegill or pseeds as well. I will have to see if I can catch a bluegill or pumpkinseed with a hook and line. I'm not sure of the laws with catching these with a net but I guess its probably not legal. Would a small bullhead work in a tank like this too?

With the minnows, I will try to get the largest ones I can find so they don't become lunch right away and I will also try to put some good places in there for them to hide in if I can. I doubt they will last long though from the sounds of it.

Would some native crays work in this tank as well?

It's more than likely that any Centrarchids(sunfish) in your state can only be collected with a hook and line. If so, then you can get small (#18) hooks and put bloodworms/small earthworms on them and you can get them as small as 1".

A bullhead will work well in a 75 gallon, just make sure there is a sufficient hiding spot for it to hide in during the day. It will soon learn when you feed, though, and come out to eat with the rest of the fish.

The minnows might last a couple of months if you start with 1" sunfish.

Crays are difficult to work with when they're kept with fish. They have to be big enough not to get eaten by the fish, but small enough not to be able to eat the fish. It's possible, but you have to keep an eye on the growth of the crawdad and the fish, and make sure one doesn't grow big enough to eat the other. Sunfish really enjoy crayfish snacks, so just make sure they aren't big enough to eat them.

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#7 Guest_Newt_*

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Posted 19 February 2008 - 01:53 PM

Check out PA's regulations here.

There are several minnows that get too large for any rock bass to handle; golden shiners and creek chubs are two examples that are readily available in your area and should do fine in your tank.

Most bullheads get fairly large and can intimidate your other fishes; you might consider a stonecat instead.

Crayfish should be fine so long as they have plenty of hiding places.

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#8 Guest_alter40_*

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Posted 19 February 2008 - 02:35 PM

Thank you for that link Newt. That will answer many of my questions for my states regulations! I will stay away from the bullheads then. I'm not sure about the stonecats, I looked them up and I don't know if i have ever caught one before. I don't catch too many catfish but I will have to pay more attention to what kind they are when I do catch another one.

I will be having plenty of rocks, native plants, and driftwood setup in the tank so I think this should give the crayfish and hopefully minnows plenty of room to hide in there.

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#9 Guest_alter40_*

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Posted 19 February 2008 - 07:48 PM

Any ideas for a cheap natural looking substrate?

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#10 Guest_ashtonmj_*

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Posted 19 February 2008 - 07:53 PM

Natural substrate...it's free (not like your running a gravel dredging operation), has stuff living with it...just depends on how many empty 5 gallon buckets you have and how far you feel like carrying them to your vehicle.

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#11 Guest_sumthinsfishy_*

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Posted 19 February 2008 - 08:21 PM

For minnows, some good ones for your tank would be some sort of chub. They can get close to a foot in length. My only concern is that they will get picked on so much by the rock bass and sunfish to the point were they die. My 1" warmouth was destroying my 4" creek chub. I had to move him.

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#12 Guest_alter40_*

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Posted 19 February 2008 - 09:37 PM

Natural substrate...it's free (not like your running a gravel dredging operation), has stuff living with it...just depends on how many empty 5 gallon buckets you have and how far you feel like carrying them to your vehicle.

I thought about this actually but I wasn't sure how safe it would be to do for an aquarium where the water movement isn't the same as it is in nature. What type of living stuff can end up in the tank as hitch hikers? Also would I need to sift out the dirt and stuff or would it be better to have kind of a muddy and rocky bottom in the tank like there is naturally in the lakes here? I would just be afraid of the mud clouding up the water and causing it to be murky.

Thanks for any info you can give me on this!

For minnows, some good ones for your tank would be some sort of chub. They can get close to a foot in length. My only concern is that they will get picked on so much by the rock bass and sunfish to the point were they die. My 1" warmouth was destroying my 4" creek chub. I had to move him.

I will have to keep them in mind when I go out collecting fish. I'm really not sure if I will end up with any minnows in my tank. I may give some a try and if they don't work out then I will leave them out for good.

I'm really glad I have joined this forum because I'm gaining a great wealth of knowledge from everybody here and from reading other posts on this forum. I really appreciate all the help that everyone here is giving me.

Thank you guys so much! :biggrin:

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#13 Guest_schambers_*

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Posted 19 February 2008 - 10:26 PM

I bought some gravel recently from a local landscaping and pond center. It's different natural colors and around 1 cm and less in size. They sell it by the ton. I bought 80 pounds for $1.28. They have sand, too.

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#14 Guest_scottefontay_*

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Posted 20 February 2008 - 07:07 AM

The living "stuff" that Ashtonmj was refering to was micro-organisms, not necessarily little critters. The bacteria and whatnot in the substrate will provide biological filtration. Farmertodd explains well below.

http://www.farmertod...e_fish_tank.pdf

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#15 Guest_alter40_*

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Posted 20 February 2008 - 04:32 PM

That is what I figured he was referring to with the living stuff but I know that with my planted tropical aquarium I have come across hitch hikers that I don't care for in my aquarium. This along with muddy crap from the creeks or lakes here clouding up my water are my main concerns with doing something like this. If these won't be problems I may go this route.

I will have to search the forums a little more thoroughly to figure out everything that I can about substrates in native tanks.

Would fish like yellow perch, rock bass, bluegill, or pumpkinseed like any current in the tank? I'm not sure if a powerhead or two would be a good idea for this tank.

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#16 Guest_Newt_*

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Posted 20 February 2008 - 04:35 PM

Rock bass would probably appreciate a little current; the rest of those species are found in still water as often as flowing, so they probably would do fine without any current.