Live foods: Feeder fish

My Gambusia finally started working out for me. The females had all been pregnant for *months* without dropping a single fry. Last weekend temps started increasing and sun was hitting the tank, and I think that brought water temperature up. I finally had the first one drop. I then brought water temperature up to 80-85 degrees, and it was fry mania! I think 5-6 different females dropped fry from Sunday-Friday, with broods of 15-30+. The fry are very large and robust -- take flake food within a day or so. I started brine shrimp for them, then realized it wasn't necessary.

This temperature thing actually turned out really well -- seems like all the females had fully-developed fry they were carrying, and bumping the temperature up caused them all to drop at once. Now I have a tank full of fry of just one age/size class -- won't have to worry about them eating each other, at least for a while.

My Gambusia finally started working out for me. The females had all been pregnant for *months* without dropping a single fry. Last weekend temps started increasing and sun was hitting the tank, and I think that brought water temperature up. I finally had the first one drop. I then brought water temperature up to 80-85 degrees, and it was fry mania! I think 5-6 different females dropped fry from Sunday-Friday, with broods of 15-30+. The fry are very large and robust -- take flake food within a day or so. I started brine shrimp for them, then realized it wasn't necessary.

This temperature thing actually turned out really well -- seems like all the females had fully-developed fry they were carrying, and bumping the temperature up caused them all to drop at once. Now I have a tank full of fry of just one age/size class -- won't have to worry about them eating each other, at least for a while.

I think they like it 80 plus atleast and they enjoy "sun bathing"
There is something about the sun they love when I had mine by side of house in shade though warm they werent as happy as they are now getting lots sun in the backyard

Considering that you could go to your local ditch to catch your breeders they'd do great!

For someone in FL, I wonder if a breeding pair of oscars would be better than a pair of convicts. In that warm weather you could simply give them a 75-100 gal container and let them go crazy.

When I first moved here I thought same thing every ditch with water has something thats not the case at all maybe further up North but not here and this is fairly 'wild" area even a farm across from me.
You have to know exactly where to go and than its not all year long.

I have gone fishing a lot and it was only last week where I saw softshell turtles tiny ones and HUGE ones. . Pygmy sunfish I havent found but have seen Mayan cichlids-Oscars other cichlids .
I allways read about finding fish in local ditches but in my case the ditches had just mosquito larvae and water bugs.

Considering that you could go to your local ditch to catch your breeders they'd do great!

For someone in FL, I wonder if a breeding pair of oscars would be better than a pair of convicts. In that warm weather you could simply give them a 75-100 gal container and let them go crazy.

lol its actually cold tonight temps going down to 60 . My big pond in yard is fine it takes days of cool temps to drop temp as day temp was over 80 today and ground holds temp but whatever fish I keep in side pond has to be small enough to come inside as no outlets there to plug in heater and rather not.
Convicts seem fun and I like them . Oscars would require a big tank inside for 2 months or another deep pond which I dont have room for

Interesting Sal. I really need to go see FL in detail someday.

I recall someone keeping an oscar in a pond where temps hit the 50's. If I read your post correctly then they do occur near you?

Only problem with convicts is you'd need to find a way to make several little "tanks"(maybe keeping the pairs seerately in nets) to increase production. You'd get a more constant flow of fry than from one big fish methinks though!

Interesting Sal. I really need to go see FL in detail someday.

I recall someone keeping an oscar in a pond where temps hit the 50's. If I read your post correctly then they do occur near you?

Only problem with convicts is you'd need to find a way to make several little "tanks"(maybe keeping the pairs seerately in nets) to increase production. You'd get a more constant flow of fry than from one big fish methinks though!

Yes I have seen Oscars -platies-mollies different colors -lots Mayan cichlids and African cichlids but its warm in the canals . It seems to me the canals have most of the exotics while the lakes do not.
The water in the canals is warm all year long as even in winter cold nights of 50s which is rare it can go to 80s or high 70s sunny during day .
The canals are wide long and deep areas as they run all over Florida but in Miami ESP its warmer than Florida .
Thats why I can not keep anything I want in the yard as an oscar can easily live,thrive,breed all yr in the canals but it will die in the yard unless fairly deep pond come Jan/Feb.

Even last night temps dropped to high 50s (freak cold spell for April) but now think its high 70s and sunny . The Platy pond is great as still warm but small volume of water in side of house would need extra heat atleast for the night .
Ofcourse bass (not Peacocks) sunfish and other real natives its fine in any non heated pond all yr long .
However the dream I had of small PVC home depot type ponds with all types small fish all over my yard was not to be lol as it can get cold at night few weeks during the year . Its to bad as they breed non stop and just look better but than again what I could possibly do with thousands of Fire Mouths

The Platy pond is great as still warm but small volume of water in side of house would need extra heat atleast for the night .
Ofcourse bass (not Peacocks) sunfish and other real natives its fine in any non heated pond all yr long .
However the dream I had of small PVC home depot type ponds with all types small fish all over my yard was not to be lol as it can get cold at night few weeks during the year . Its to bad as they breed non stop and just look better but than again what I could possibly do with thousands of Fire Mouths

You could try little mini greenhouses (cold frames) or just clear plastic tents to put over them at night when cold. Or... probably could even just float solid foam insulation on the water surface (leave a bit exposed for gas exchange) when it gets cold. You'll pay about $10 for a 4' x 8' closed-cell foam one at the home stores.

You could try little mini greenhouses (cold frames) or just clear plastic tents to put over them at night when cold. Or... probably could even just float solid foam insulation on the water surface (leave a bit exposed for gas exchange) when it gets cold. You'll pay about $10 for a 4' x 8' closed-cell foam one at the home stores.

That would work hold in heat? Lets say day temp was 78 but that night it dropped to 55 those things would hold heat in lets say 120 gallons of water?

The bigger pond just stays fairly warm 70s to 80s regardless of temp but side pond I was thinking of is small volume thus temp change affects it

That would work hold in heat? Lets say day temp was 78 but that night it dropped to 55 those things would hold heat in lets say 120 gallons of water?
The bigger pond just stays fairly warm 70s to 80s regardless of temp but side pond I was thinking of is small volume thus temp change affects it

Yes, absolutely. I'd say just get sheets of foam, cut them to fit, and float them on the surface at night. Leave a bit of open water to allow gas exchange. You're essentially building a hot-tub cover here -- and those things *definitely* work.

If you need a bit more heat during the day, a little "greenhouse" tent made of clear plastic would do the trick. You could just prop it up with a central pole in the middle, and hold down the edges with rocks around the perimeter. A heavy-duty painting dropcloth would do the trick and be very cheap.

Yes, absolutely. I'd say just get sheets of foam, cut them to fit, and float them on the surface at night. Leave a bit of open water to allow gas exchange. You're essentially building a hot-tub cover here -- and those things *definitely* work.

If you need a bit more heat during the day, a little "greenhouse" tent made of clear plastic would do the trick. You could just prop it up with a central pole in the middle, and hold down the edges with rocks around the perimeter. A heavy-duty painting dropcloth would do the trick and be very cheap.

Thanks would have never thought to try that. I think yesterday was the last cold night 50s for the yr and now the real heat should start but going with a pair of convicts by side of house and prefer to keep them out all yr if possible.
I cant put them in backyard pond as they would kill my platies-swordtails,etc plus would never be able to catch the fry.
I plan to use a plastic pond bury it thus the ground will help hold heat come Jan/feb but as a whole its still fairly warm but do need warmth on some night your ideas I will try .

Thanks

Btw, sorry for hijacking the thread...but this has been giving me ideas.
Does anyone have any experience putting cichlids into backyard ponds? I'm in CA, and while they won't survive the winter...it'd be fun and finding sunfish has been hard I know it is a common thing to put tropicals outdoors. I've thought about it and thought of using several Dempseys and possibly some livebearers for my larger pond, and paradise fish for the smaller. Keep the bug population down, and in fall fish will be brought in for store credit. The state does give out gambusia(while they survive the winter here nicely, I dislike them). A nice thing would be a fresh slate each spring for a new experiment.

Thoughts?

Actually...what about rainbow cichlids? They may be an appropriate substitute to convicts. Also easier to sell.

Dredging up an old topic... how did this turn out? I was considering setting up a tank or two for this purpose soon. Did the convicts end up growing fast enough to provide a significant food source?

I'm able to supplement the tank-raised feeders with wild-caught Gambusia, but I need something in the house for times when I can't make time for live food expeditions, especially with a kid on the way.

I also want to raise various invertebrates as feeders for my mummichogs too, particularly pond snails and ghost shrimp. Are those compatible with t he cichlids? Someone recently mentioned having problems with snails eating fish eggs, and I've also heard that ghost shrimp can catch and eat very small fry. I don't have any experience with egg-layers and very small fry.

My advice since I have done this is do not get more than 1 pr of convicts, I had 2 and I ended up with hundreds of fry, and when small in well planted tanks they hide and can grow faster than the NA counterparts that they were intended to be food for, this left me tearing apart a well planted tank to remove one. I initially started this as feeders for my oscar but he has adopted the ones I tried to feed him and until my blue spotted sunfish get bigger I am giving the fry to a local fish store, they frow rather quickly I have some that are about an inch long that are only a couple months old, they may grow faster if I had them in a bigger growout tank. The one I mentioned in my oscar tank are about an inch long and beginning to pair off as well. I am now down to 1pr since after the last 2 batches of fry hatched my male went crazy and attacked the female and consuming the fry, the last attack killed the female and the male is now gone.

I doubt I'll have any great surplus of fry with a pair of pikes and mummichogs. As the pickerel grow I think I'll need quite a few of these little guys. I haven't seen any evidence that "adoption" is a problem with these fish either. When I started they were quite small and I had some Gambusia of all different sizes, including many that were rather larger than the pickerel and intended to drop fry to provide a constant source of snacks. Now the midsize ones are starting to disappear, including some that had shared the tank for months.

If you can house 2 pair plus growout tanks for the fry then it might not be a bad idea in your case, thise will keep you in good supply, I have found mine only mate after the fry are removed from the tanks but I know other that have not had this issue. If interested the easiest way is to go to petsmart, if you have one, and look at what they have, the females have some bright orange coloration and the males ahve no coloration, if going for 2 pairs I would buy 2 males and 3 to 4 females and put them all in the same tank, this way they can form their pairs and the other females can be used as feeders. They breed at a very small size so if you can see the coloration then they are able to breed. Plus the fry only need tropical flakes, I crush some up and thats it no other special care other than leaving them with the parents for a couple weeks atleast.

I read on another forum that the eggs would be fine if you provided a removable spawning substrate like a flowerpot and just removed the eggs to the growout tank immediately after they were laid so the adults would spawn again quickly. Any comment on that?

Are older fry cannibalistic at all? Can I keep several age classes together in one growout tank?

I hate to use a 55 for such ugly tropical cichlids, but I think that's what's going to happen. Maybe I'll end up liking them

oddly enough i am attempting to do the same thing...collect a few grass pike and set up some feeder tanks to grow my own food for the pike...

i have my convicts which are just about old enough to start breeding and looking into starting up some cherry shrimp as i figured the pike would love those guys...i was wondering if the grass pike would eat frozen shrimp....and or frozen fry...i am sure it would take some getting used too but i thought it might be worth a shot...if so would i just have to throw the shrimp into the freezer right from the tank?

to answer your question about the convicts, they are quite aggresive, even the fry, i took about 8 fry off someones hands about 4 months ago and I only have 3 left, it was kind of survival of the fittest, i noticed a couple with missing tails, but i am sure with a larger group more would obviously survive and a larger tank....i was kind of hoping the convicts would then put up more of a fight for the pike and make the hunt more interesting, as feeder goldfish tend to just find a spot and stay there...

either way its still my plan to raise convicts and cherry shrimp to feed my future grass pike/pickerel...w/e

its awesome hearing that others are out there doing something similar and to hear about your trials and errors...keep it going thanks