Mark (airbrn1187) and I got out for the first time this year. Water conditions were pretty bad since the storms of last week still had the creek swollen. We decided that it wasn't worth making a long trip so we split the difference and met about half way between our homes. I wanted to try out some new photo equipment and technique so Mark and I took a whole mess of photos. We sampled both a medium stream and a tiny nearby feeder creek. We began to catch fatheads in the tiny feeder creek which at first I was surprised since I've never caught a wild fathead minnow. Then we caught a "rosy red". We saw what appeared to be two year classes of them so either someone has been releasing them over an extended period (and a whole lot of them) or they're reproducing here. I come to this site every year and have never caught them previously. I'm still a bit surprised since even the medium creek is too small to attract the attention of anglers.

Semotilus atromaculatus.


Pimephales promelas



Pimephales notatus


Notropis rubellus



Notropis atherinoides



Luxilus chrysocephalus


Lepomis cyanellus


Oh yeah...let me know if I messed up the ID on the Notropis atherinoides

I wanted to show lots of Etheostoma spectabile even though it's still a bit early for best color. I wanted to show the variability since all of these fish came from the same stream on the same day. Nothing terribly different but some are apparent.
















Oh yeah.. we also found a few Etheostoma nigrum


In addition to the above photos we found:
Campostoma anomalum
Nocomis biguttatus
Notropis stramineus
Catostomus commersoni


I think that's it...did I miss anything Mark?

Nice photos, Uland! Thanks for sharing! I'm hoping to get out collecting up here in Wisconsin in the next week or two. It's supposed to be 68*F here tomorrow! The water's still cold, though!

Brian

Nice photos, Uland! Thanks for sharing! I'm hoping to get out collecting up here in Wisconsin in the next week or two. It's supposed to be 68*F here tomorrow! The water's still cold, though!

Brian

We had a good time....seemed like forever since we have been in the water. Dang you Uland making me think. I also checked the IHNS site and according to them Fatheads have been there for awhile. Correct me if I am wrong, didn't we also catch

Catostomus commersoni
Campostoma anomalum
Nocomis biguttatus
Notropis ludibundus

And as a side note...to all who know Uland.....he kept the same piece of grass for the WHOLE photo shoot!!

It's been fun watching you perfect your techniques. You've really got it down good. The white and grey background ones are prefect, not a spot of shadow.
I prefer those over the black background, just my personal taste, they're all beautiful.

We had a good time....seemed like forever since we have been in the water. Dang you Uland making me think. I also checked the IHNS site and according to them Fatheads have been there for awhile. Correct me if I am wrong, didn't we also catch

Catostomus commersoni
Campostoma anomalum
Nocomis biguttatus
Notropis ludibundus

And as a side note...to all who know Uland.....he kept the same piece of grass for the WHOLE photo shoot!!

It really has been far too long since we got out. We sure did catch the fish you listed but N. ludibundus is now N. stramineus. The state either does not recognize the change or has not yet updated their records. I just looked up the collection records and yeah...Pimephales promelas were first documented in 1982. Since we found the "rosy red" I still think these are a recent introduction.

It's been fun watching you perfect your techniques. You've really got it down good. The white and grey background ones are prefect, not a spot of shadow.
I prefer those over the black background, just my personal taste, they're all beautiful.

I had hoped to get some input on the photos. I naturally gravitate to a lighter background but it's nearly impossible to get background uniformity when using a light background. I'm trying this year to have uniform backgrounds to make the photos universally useful. I tried on much of this group to force them into a black background to see what people think (I think it looks unnatural but the details "pop"). I'm still undecided on how to achieve background uniformity and I hope to get it worked out before I take too many photos. Any input is welcome.

Do you cut and paste onto the white and grey backgrounds, or only the black ones?

Do you cut and paste onto the white and grey backgrounds, or only the black ones?

On recent photos I cut and paste on all backgrounds. I find it's much faster than cleaning up any other way. I really can go one of two way with the photos...Work on getting the black background much darker and force the photos on black or just succumb to my natural instinct and try to match the natural background color to my paste job. Decisions, decisions

Uland, those are looking pretty doggone good, glad to hear you're getting out! While the black sometimes makes the fins look too light, I like having everything standardized across all of my photos... but you already know that. That said, that striped shiner looks sweet, maybe the 30% (35%?) grey is the way to go... but I'm NOT going back and redoing all of my backgrounds!

I just got the new macro lens so should be back in business soon (finally!!), assuming the rivers come back down to a workable level...

Dave

As always, wow! Those are some robust orangethroats!

Now, I hate to do this to you Uland, but those nape scales on that "chrysocephalus" are lookin' pretty danged small

Todd

I think the light and medium backgrounds are working the best. With the black, the clear fins look like they are white.

Awsome photos, btw.

Uland, those are looking pretty doggone good, glad to hear you're getting out! While the black sometimes makes the fins look too light, I like having everything standardized across all of my photos... but you already know that. That said, that striped shiner looks sweet, maybe the 30% (35%?) grey is the way to go... but I'm NOT going back and redoing all of my backgrounds!

I just got the new macro lens so should be back in business soon (finally!!), assuming the rivers come back down to a workable level...

Dave

Golly thanks Dave.
The more I try to standardize the more I understand why you use black background. If your grey background matches too closely, detail can be lost. If you always use the same grey background, it's only a matter of time before you try and put the wrong photo to fit the grey. Going back to rework backgrounds would make me go mad. I get very fidgety both mentally and through coordination after editing several photos.

Did you get the 60mm f/2.8 canon lens Dave?

Now, I hate to do this to you Uland, but those nape scales on that "chrysocephalus" are lookin' pretty danged small icon_wink.gif

Todd, I always welcome ID help and I think all of us are here to improve our ID skills. Please don't be shy about pointing me in the right direction. I still don't have the L. chrysocephalus vs L. cornutus scale thing figured out. I need to make that a priority this year and gather lots of photos to help me. Once I feel more confident distinguishing the two, I might challenge the state ID but for now the state says they are L. chrysocephalus and I'm in no position to say otherwise.

I'm fairly certain I've attached the wrong minnow head to the Emerald shiner and need to look into that when I get home.

I think the light and medium backgrounds are working the best. With the black, the clear fins look like they are white.

Awsome photos, btw.

Thanks Nativeplanter. I think I now have something to shoot for. I will keep trying to make better photos for black background but will find a standardized grey background for this year.

I really appreciate the input from everyone.

Todd, I always welcome ID help and I think all of us are here to improve our ID skills. Please don't be shy about pointing me in the right direction. I still don't have the L. chrysocephalus vs L. cornutus scale thing figured out. I need to make that a priority this year and gather lots of photos to help me. Once I feel more confident distinguishing the two, I might challenge the state ID but for now the state says they are L. chrysocephalus and I'm in no position to say otherwise.

I'm fairly certain I've attached the wrong minnow head to the Emerald shiner and need to look into that when I get home.

Okey dokey, I could just hear your groan when I was considering pointing it out. I'm really glad you don't take it as me saying "YOURE WRONG!" 'Coz that's not how I roll (Well, in my mind anyway. The details are left in the interpretation, unfortunately, when typing)

You're gonna get this down this year man. Then you can drive yourself crazy with volucellus and stramineus next lol.

If you guys do midway sampling again, you should check out that little watershed that flows just east of Sandwich. You could stop in and talk to Dave and my friends there at the car dealer too... There was a nice looking spring fed ditch/stream that looked like sculpinville behind the dealership. I can get you better coordinates if interested. Some of the beefy-est rainbows I'd ever seen just to the west of there too, I think another trib of the Fox.

And I agree, I think you post a really nice head photo of rubellus from the other angle (which is useful too).

Todd

Did a little looking and see the "crowded" scales....this really complicates things to be honest. I need to look into references to help me with this since I will be expanding L. cornutus range. I will gather photos this year and make a new topic for sure.

I see orange, black and turquoise anal fins on these E. spectabile. Anyone else see this in their populations?

I forgot to post a pan shot of our dead landscape, so here it is.

Pick up Fishes of Missouri. His line drawings will solve all the mysteries of Luxilus, Notropis and Cottus.

I noticed the orange as well. Are there rainbows present? That might also explain some of the beefyness.

Todd

Pick up Fishes of Missouri. His line drawings will solve all the mysteries of Luxilus, Notropis and Cottus.

Todd

Ha! I like that statement, it made me choke on a mouthful of coffee. And it could be true, that's one of the state books I don't have. As to Cottus, I always know a sculpin when I see it.....

Ha! I like that statement, it made me choke on a mouthful of coffee. And it could be true, that's one of the state books I don't have. As to Cottus, I always know a sculpin when I see it.....

I always know a "little silver jobbie" when I see it too, but that tells you only so much lol. I don't envy the ID factory that Alabama is for sculpin. I think you have to have Dave standing next to you to even have a chance lol.

I see orange, black and turquoise anal fins on these E. spectabile. Anyone else see this in their populations?

Uland like with everything else it appears to be watershed specific. Here downstate their anal fins stay a deep solid turquoise. Some are light, some almost black. The oranges only appear closer to rainbow country.

I think the gray is pretty sharp but I can imagine keeping the gradient would be difficult. I know we've discussed this before, but I enjoy your white backgrounds with the shadows.

Pick up Fishes of Missouri. His line drawings will solve all the mysteries of Luxilus, Notropis and Cottus.

I noticed the orange as well. Are there rainbows present? That might also explain some of the beefyness.

Todd

I actually grew up with Fishes of Missouri and still have the original copy. I checked the updated version to be sure but that book doesn't provide lateral drawings for either and it focuses on features (dorsal stripes and chin pigment) that would clearly put these and the other fish Ive been calling L. chrysocephalus as L. chrysocephalus. So what references are you using for L. conutus vs. L. chrysocephalus?

The state says rainbows are present and recall identifying few as such when starting out but I've not seen anything I'd call a rainbow in a long time. I'll head back in a few weeks once the water goes down a bit and they color up a bit better.

uland, looks like you had a good time.
one day i hope to take shots like that.
its threads like this one why i am a member now.
thanks for the thread.a real breath of fresh air.

ps, why are your fish all heads left?
your choice or is it a clock in the picture thing? you no the time is all ways
10 minutes after 10am or 10 minutes till 2pm kinda thing.

Edited by CATfishTONY, 18 March 2009 - 08:05 PM.