So, today I ran up to the 'head of the holler' where my parents live in Harlan County KY, to were the class II stream begins in the Upper Cumberland. I wasn't expecting much because of the HEAVY HEAVY rain yesterday, but within 2 minutes I caught two large daces. The second was a breading male, looked mostly like a Blacknose. However, the first was different. It had the really long nose on it, just like a Longnose Dace, but didn't have the dark coloration of other Longnose Dace I've seen. The eyes were on top of the head, had the speckles like daces do and the long snout. Maybe this was a large female, and species lists shows that the Longnose Dace and Blacknose are in Harlan County, KY. However, seeing these two species in the same riffle makes me wonder how freely the Longnose and Blacknose could hybritize (is that the right word?)

This area is the headwater of 'Wallins Creek' that feeds into the Cumberland. There are 3 forks that form the creek, it then flows nearly 4 miles, picking up other forks, then entering the Cumberland River. I was also a little shocked to find fish that far up the creek, I think I'll go back tomorrow.

Cheat Minnow???? Could it be possible??

Cheat Minnow???? Could it be possible??

No, and unlikely that you got longnose in the Cumberland, either. Probably just a female "blacknose." They do look pretty funky up there, try to snap some pics if you can. Turns out the Cheat Minnow isn't real; just a funky, continuously-produced hybrid. I'm eating crow on that one...

I agree, the Cheat Minnow is a hybrid, but I've seen a share of blacknose daces, they are very common in Central KY. What I caught was no Blacknose dace. I have seined a few 4+ inch blacknoses, and this wasn't like any I've seen. I checked the KY species list, it does list the Longnose Dace in this county, so somebody has found them here. I'm going back out shortly, maybe I'll get a pic.

No, and unlikely that you got longnose in the Cumberland, either. Probably just a female "blacknose." They do look pretty funky up there, try to snap some pics if you can. Turns out the Cheat Minnow isn't real; just a funky, continuously-produced hybrid. I'm eating crow on that one...

I've seen quite a few hybrid cyprinids from eastern Kentucky. Any of the nest spawners in that area seem to produce a small amount of hybrids every year. The BSD streams and range seemed to have Phoxinus and Semotilusx whatever. I did often notice many from the upper Cumberland and the upper Tennesse have a longer than normal snout. The Cumberland drainage are also obtusus, right? It just wasn't THAT long, i.e. longnose.

So no more Pararhinictchys Dave?

I managed to get back up to that location on Sunday, but I didn't catch any quite like the first one I caught on Saturday. That first Dace was greenish above and white below and had a really really long nose. I really think it was a either a hybrid or a strange variant.

On Sunday I caught this male Blacknose. Notice the length from the eye to the nose and the position of the eye is nearly on top of the head.






Matt, what do you think? You've seen more of these from different drainages.

It looks like a regular blacknose/smoky dace to me, especially one that comes from the Blue Ridge. Wouldn't you agree Dave?

It looks like a regular blacknose/smoky dace to me, especially one that comes from the Blue Ridge. Wouldn't you agree Dave?

You may be right, but those look NOTHING like the blacknose dace here in Central KY. Those had noses that were a LOT LOT LOT longer.