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2009 Convention - Message from Brady Porter

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#1 ichthyskid

  • NANFA Guest

Posted 06 October 2009 - 10:22 PM

Dear NANFA members:

Thank you for the opportunity to talk about the Pteronotropis species complex at the 2009 NANFA conference. I felt the meeting was a great success, with many outstanding talks, good field trips, and overall excellent planning for the meeting. I enjoyed sampling with many of you at the Alafia River trip on Saturday. Some of the "Alafia shiners" we collected were the largest I have seen and it pleases me that you will be able to enjoy their beauty in your home aquariums and see if you can unlock some of the secrets of their spawning and larval development. We concentrated on taking smaller ones that should breed for you next spring and summer. I am especially interested if the newly hatched larvae glue their heads to substrate, and if so, how long until they become free swimming. The "attached" stage is said to be dark, changing to clear when they go pelagic. Any photos of the larvae would be great. I am also looking for any good pictures you may get from adult "Alafia shiners," P. metallicus from the Santa Fe trip, or P. colei from the Ocala system (Juniper Creek). If you are willing to donate pictures to me (with their collecting locality), I may include them in our species description paper with your photo credit, or in future talks on the groups. It would also help if you are able to provide a standard length of the photographed specimen, but if this is no longer possible, that is ok too- they are still valuable for science.

The large specimens of the "Alafia shiner," those greater than 35mm standard length (tip of snout to structural base of tail) will probably not live to next year's breeding season (May through August). I was handicapped by flying this year and was unable to take any samples in formalin for science. I was hoping that members would be willing to preserve some of these larger specimens (after photographic attempts or after they die naturally) and send them to me for additional counts and measurements for the species description. I can send you some 10% formaldehyde if you are willing, and provide me with your mailing address. I can be reached by email at porterb@duq.edu, by office phone at 412-396-5786 or cell 412-337-7397. Feel free to update me on how your spawning efforts are going. A pdf copy of our Pteronotropis stonei description with comparisons to other close geographic species is available upon request. Our next paper will provide a formal re-description of P. metallicus, and the two new species (the "Alafia shiner" and P. colei). I will share that pdf with the membership when it is out. I appreciate all your efforts in working with these wonderful fish.

Brady Porter

Dr. Brady A. Porter
Department of Biological Sciences
Duquesne University
600 Forbes Ave.
Pittsburgh, PA 15282

#2 fundulus

  • Global Moderator

Posted 07 October 2009 - 07:19 AM

Thanks, Brady, for speaking at the convention. You might be the first repeat speaker at a NANFA convention.
Bruce Stallsmith, Huntsville, Alabama, US of A

#3 FourSeineFeet

  • NANFA Guest

Posted 07 October 2009 - 07:09 PM

Thanks, Brady, for speaking at the convention. You might be the first repeat speaker at a NANFA convention.

That is just because he spoke earlier in the day than Bob Muller.

#4 Casper

  • NANFA Fellow

Posted 09 October 2009 - 04:16 PM

Dont forget Scott Mettee, Chattanooga 98 and Huntsville and Wayne Heaton 3 times, including again in his home state as our host!
Casper Cox
Chattanooga, near the TN Divide on BlueFishRidge overlooking South Chickamauga Creek.

#5 keepnatives

  • Regional Rep

Posted 09 October 2009 - 06:17 PM

I went on the Juniper Creek Ocala trip Sunday and got some P. colei, they may just be the most colorful Pteronotropis wow! Unfortunately don't know if any are females. Have some small ones hopefully some will turn out to be females. Had gotten some Sailfins before the conference but these make them look pale in comparison.
Mike Lucas
Mohawk-Hudson Watershed
Schenectady NY

#6 Mysteryman

  • NANFA Member

Posted 10 October 2009 - 09:35 AM

So is it done, the official Pteronotropis rework? Do we finally have the new official list of species?
Man, I hate having missed this!
Are Redeyes now in the group?
Does Alafia have a latin name yet? What makes them distinct? ( phenotypically, that is )
Are coleis as nice as they sound? Do they have a common name yet? ( Ocala? Cole's? Juniper? ) What makes them distinct?

#7 Dustin

  • Forum Staff

Posted 12 October 2009 - 10:27 AM

What's currently being proposed by Brady and Suttkus is not a total rework of Pteronotropis as far as I can tell. It is a description of two new species and a redescription of Pt. metallicus. The two new species are proposed as Pt. colei and Pt. thompsoni(though this one is not concrete yet). I believe thompsoni will be commonly named the Alafia shiner. I don't remember if a common name has been chosen yet for colei.

There was some interesting genetic data presented by Jason Allen that delved a little further into Pteronotropis as a whole. As suspected, welaka and hubbsi are fairly distinct from the rest of the sailfin types, including signipinnis and euryzonus, and they do closely group with N. harperi. Jason's PhD work should be available shortly and may lead to the formal separation of these.

On another note, you also missed the formal description of a new Elassoma sp., E. gilberti.

Dustin Smith
At the convergence of the Broad, Saluda and Congaree
Lexington, SC

#8 Mysteryman

  • NANFA Member

Posted 20 October 2009 - 11:28 PM

Really?? Another Pygmy as well? Cooolll...

#9 FourSeineFeet

  • NANFA Guest

Posted 10 February 2010 - 12:09 PM

Pictures take yesterday and today.

Peronotropis thompsoni stuck to tank glass

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More Alafia Shiners

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Elassoma gilberti

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Phoxinus eos (Northern Redbelly Dace)

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#10 Guest_BTDarters_*

  • Guests

Posted 13 February 2010 - 04:31 AM

Very cool pictures Phil! Nice job!