Edited by SunnyRollins, 18 November 2009 - 08:07 PM.
Fish Enrichment
Started by
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, Nov 18 2009 07:29 PM
30 replies to this topic
#1
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Posted 18 November 2009 - 07:29 PM
Well I am very curious as to just how intelligent sunnies really are(killies too...but they don't show signs of being super smart). Is there anyway I can enrich them? Any toys or activities for them?
#2
Guest_fundulus_*
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Posted 18 November 2009 - 07:38 PM
Assuming you're serious, no, their brains don't have a cerebral cortex to handle higher thought.
#3
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Posted 18 November 2009 - 07:44 PM
I've heard of people training goldfish to swim through a "maze" of sorts by getting glass dividers and cuttig holes in them and putting a coloured circle around the hole and putting the food on the other side of the glass and then add a new sheet of glass every couple of days and they seem to learn how to get through them.
#4
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Posted 18 November 2009 - 07:46 PM
Assuming you're serious, no, their brains don't have a cerebral cortex to handle higher thought.
So there's absolutely nothing I can do besides look at my fish, feed them, and perform partial water changes?
I'm not expecting my sunnies to learn how to play fetch, I just want to make the life for my fish as best as possible.
#5
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Posted 18 November 2009 - 07:49 PM
I've heard of people training goldfish to swim through a "maze" of sorts by getting glass dividers and cuttig holes in them and putting a coloured circle around the hole and putting the food on the other side of the glass and then add a new sheet of glass every couple of days and they seem to learn how to get through them.
Yes they did that on Mythbusters.
#6
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Posted 18 November 2009 - 07:52 PM
YA that's where i got it from. I tried to find a video on Facetube but came out empty handed.Yes they did that on Mythbusters.
#7
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Posted 18 November 2009 - 11:03 PM
Or is it a myth about Mythbusters? But with goldfish you could probably orient them to following a chemical scent trail, rather than learn and remember a course to swim through in a way consistent with abstract reasoning. I'd like to say fish are that smart, but there's a reason public shows use dolphins rather than scarlet shiners.
#8
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Posted 18 November 2009 - 11:17 PM
Or is it a myth about Mythbusters? But with goldfish you could probably orient them to following a chemical scent trail, rather than learn and remember a course to swim through in a way consistent with abstract reasoning. I'd like to say fish are that smart, but there's a reason public shows use dolphins rather than scarlet shiners.
I have this great mental image of SeaWorld having a scarlet shiner show and getting booed since they don't do anything.
Do you think a fish like a green sunfish or bluegill could learn something as simple as touching its nose to a stick for food?
#9
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Posted 18 November 2009 - 11:20 PM
Or is it a myth about Mythbusters?
Ha ha! No, I saw the episode. Adam killed most of his fish because he didn't know about cycling the tank. Jaime trained his fish to associate food with a color, then colored holes in tank dividers. The fish swam right through.
#10
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Posted 18 November 2009 - 11:51 PM
OK, relating color to food I can believe. It's like waving a small sheet of red paper outside a tank with a male Betta or stickleback and triggering an aggression response, fish will certainly respond to colors one way or another.
#11
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Posted 19 November 2009 - 06:12 AM
I would have to say the best enrichment you can offer sunfish is live food, as that gets them exercise and mental stimulation. If you want fish that are trained to respond to certain cues to perform a cool behavior, try this: http://www.fish-school.com/
If it works for oscars and goldfish it should work for sunfish.
If it works for oscars and goldfish it should work for sunfish.
#12
Guest_nativeplanter_*
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Posted 19 November 2009 - 07:49 AM
Oh, heck. If you want to try to train your fish, go at it. What is it going to hurt? Just don't be dissapointed if they don't get it. The only thing I would say is to make sure you don't accidentally cause stress, by moving them out of the tank or scaring them in the training process.
#13
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Posted 19 November 2009 - 12:06 PM
Well I'll try to find out if sunnies see red first. I can't find much on them seeing colors.
Catfish hunter, thanks for the link!
Catfish hunter, thanks for the link!
#14
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Posted 19 November 2009 - 12:57 PM
I would have to say the best enrichment you can offer sunfish is live food, as that gets them exercise and mental stimulation. If you want fish that are trained to respond to certain cues to perform a cool behavior, try this: http://www.fish-school.com/
If it works for oscars and goldfish it should work for sunfish.
I use live food for enrichment too. I wish I could make it last longer though. No matter how many feeders I buy they are now gone in a day. They no longer leave survivors.
#15
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Posted 19 November 2009 - 02:57 PM
I agree.I would have to say the best enrichment you can offer sunfish is live food, as that gets them exercise and mental stimulation. If you want fish that are trained to respond to certain cues to perform a cool behavior, try this: http://www.fish-school.com/
If it works for oscars and goldfish it should work for sunfish.
#16
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Posted 20 November 2009 - 01:54 AM
Well I'll try to find out if sunnies see red first. I can't find much on them seeing colors.
Catfish hunter, thanks for the link!
No problem, it also works for bettas so it may also work for mudminnows and killifish! Who knows until someone tries? Also, I am pretty sure that sunfish can see pretty good colors, and red especially since I think bass and cichlids can see red. Hope that helps!
#17
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Posted 20 November 2009 - 02:02 AM
I use live food for enrichment too. I wish I could make it last longer though. No matter how many feeders I buy they are now gone in a day. They no longer leave survivors.
I have the same problem, haha, but at least they appreciate it.
#18
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Posted 20 November 2009 - 06:36 PM
Don't tell me that fish are dumb! My darters recognize me when I walk around the room and beg for food when they see me walk by.
Brian
Brian
#19
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Posted 20 November 2009 - 08:43 PM
Are you talking about enrichment as in:
Or are you talking about Operant conditioning to just make an animal do a specific action on cue?
They are different things... Both are used in captive animal management sometimes in "dual use". Training can be enrichment. But enrichment used in context has a different goal and purpose then just training.
I personally work heavily in the area of Enrichment for both Herps and fish and could likely point you to some good ideas if I understood what your looking for here.
“…a process for improving or enhancing animal environments and care within the context of their inhabitants’ behavioral biology and natural history. It is a dynamic process in which changes to structures and husbandry practices are made with the goal of increasing behavioral choices available to animals and drawing out their species-appropriate behaviors and abilities, thus enhancing animal welfare (AZA/BAG 1999).
Or are you talking about Operant conditioning to just make an animal do a specific action on cue?
They are different things... Both are used in captive animal management sometimes in "dual use". Training can be enrichment. But enrichment used in context has a different goal and purpose then just training.
I personally work heavily in the area of Enrichment for both Herps and fish and could likely point you to some good ideas if I understood what your looking for here.
#20
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Posted 24 November 2009 - 04:50 PM
I'd be interested in seeing what kind of enrichment herps receive. I've heard of leaving scents around the tank for snakes and the like but this probably would have no effect on fish.
You could devise a clear plastic ball with a hole and put some shrimp/other moving creatures into it. I bet the sunfish would knock this around and eventually figure out how to scare the food item out and eat it.
You could devise a clear plastic ball with a hole and put some shrimp/other moving creatures into it. I bet the sunfish would knock this around and eventually figure out how to scare the food item out and eat it.
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