Darter ID

Are you sure it came from NY or VA? Have you gotten any darters from members out of state? Did I give you any darters from my collection? I know I had some male Orangethroats I wanted to clear out a while back with no females and I don't recall who I gave them to or if they became Pickeral snacks.

Could use some photo tank shots without the tank decor reflections and shadows.

Mike

Are you sure it came from NY or VA? Have you gotten any darters from members out of state? Did I give you any darters from my collection? I know I had some male Orangethroats I wanted to clear out a while back with no females and I don't recall who I gave them to or if they became Pickeral snacks.

Could use some photo tank shots without the tank decor reflections and shadows.

Mike

nah mike this wasnt from you. only thing you ever gave me were the logperchs. this had to of came from NY. other members have sent me varigate and stripped and thats def not the varigate i got.

Not a chance on variatum. This fish is spectabile through and through, unless it came from Kentucky, then who the heck knows.

Cut off a piece of tail fin, drop in in some vodka, and send it to me. DNA will give a pretty quick answer. P.S. Identification by DNA services come at a small fee of $200 a sample

Ummm... If someone sent you virgatum, are you sure they were all virgatum?

I've got $5 that's what Pat Ceas will soon formally describe at the thoroughbred darter.

And the "all blue" thing really doesn't hold up all the time, although it's a nice general guide.

Todd

Ummm... If someone sent you virgatum, are you sure they were all virgatum?

I've got $5 that's what Pat Ceas will soon formally describe at the thoroughbred darter.

And the "all blue" thing really doesn't hold up all the time, although it's a nice general guide.

Todd

i only had one virgatum. and yup thats what he was

While this darter is out of my range, it sure looks like a Etheostoma spectabile fragi. This is based on a picture in Handbook of Darter by Page, plate 30b.

I know I hate picture keying, but it does look very similar.

David

Did I not send you an O.throat from here in Central KY. I think that I did, and if so, I agree with Todd that it would be the soon to be described Thoroughbred Darter.

Did I not send you an O.throat from here in Central KY. I think that I did, and if so, I agree with Todd that it would be the soon to be described Thoroughbred Darter.

I thought u sent me a varigate. Stripped and blusbreast lol

Yeah, maybe you're right. I read back through pm's, I guess I didn't. Did I send you fish once or twice. Seems like I sent somebody an Othroat.

I still have $5 that's a thoroughbred darter

Todd

I still have $5 that's a thoroughbred darter

Todd

You should come see those here in Lexington KY. People cant believe that such a beautiful fish lives in nasty, slimey, dirty creeks that drain through Lexington...I can hardly believe it myself.

Now we need to figure out how this got in eatern NY.

Hmmm.... that just has spectible written all over it. In particular, the pronounced white stripe on the anterior dorsal is a spectible trademark, assuming that it otherwise follows the spectible/caerelum form. E careleum doesn't have that stripe, at least none of the ones I've found show it, and I've found hundreds of them. As for it being the sp variant found in Lexington KY, maybe... maybe not... hard to say without a more detailed photo. If it wasn't found in Wolf Creek or upper Elkhorn, it's probably not that.

One thing I learned early on about darters is not to leap to conclusions about ID's, the variations can be very subtle, and highly dependent upon where they were found. 'Sort of looks like' will fool you every time - darter identification can be a humbling experience.

You can see a photo of the 'thoroughbred darter' on My Darter Page it's the one right under the rainbow. That's in full breeding colors. After a year in the tank, it has faded to dark vertical stripes only. What you have here is somewhat similar. Compare that to the photo of the headwater darter, another spectible variant that looks nothing like the thoroughbred or even the standard orangethroat. Where is a DNA sequencer when you need one?

This one is a puzzle, but my gut feel is another spectible variant.

Hmmm.... that just has spectible written all over it. In particular, the pronounced white stripe on the anterior dorsal is a spectible trademark, assuming that it otherwise follows the spectible/caerelum form. E careleum doesn't have that stripe, at least none of the ones I've found show it, and I've found hundreds of them. As for it being the sp variant found in Lexington KY, maybe... maybe not... hard to say without a more detailed photo. If it wasn't found in Wolf Creek or upper Elkhorn, it's probably not that.

One thing I learned early on about darters is not to leap to conclusions about ID's, the variations can be very subtle, and highly dependent upon where they were found. 'Sort of looks like' will fool you every time - darter identification can be a humbling experience.

You can see a photo of the 'thoroughbred darter' on My Darter Page it's the one right under the rainbow. That's in full breeding colors. After a year in the tank, it has faded to dark vertical stripes only. What you have here is somewhat similar. Compare that to the photo of the headwater darter, another spectible variant that looks nothing like the thoroughbred or even the standard orangethroat. Where is a DNA sequencer when you need one?

This one is a puzzle, but my gut feel is another spectible variant.

thanks john. i guess the biggest puzzle still is how was this fish caught in Eastern NY