Hey I am new to the forum. I have started a darter tank that is 125 gal. I started out with 8 small redlines, 1 larger redline, and a greenside. After about 2 weeks I lost 4 small redlines and don't know why. I have a powerhead and 2 canister filters. I feed them bloodworms and earthworms.
My thoughts are they are eating too much or maybe the 5" greenside has something to do with it? When I feed them, the little guys eat everything they see and the bigger greenside and redline don't eat while I'm in the room.
Also they have died one at a time during the night.
Any thoughts would help thanks
New darter tank
Started by
Guest_Holstonriv22_*
, Mar 19 2012 05:19 PM
11 replies to this topic
#2
Michael Wolfe
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- Board of Directors
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- North Georgia, Oconee River Drainage
Posted 19 March 2012 - 05:27 PM
Lots of questions here, but I would start with a reminder to everyone about the legal status of collecting fish in TN. Know your local laws.
How long was the tank set up before the fish were added?
Where the filters used on a previous tank or are they new?
What is the substrate in the tank?
What hiding spots are available for the smaller fish to get away?
In general, I dont think that a darter ever died from eating too much... too little, sometimes... too much, I just don't buy it.
How long was the tank set up before the fish were added?
Where the filters used on a previous tank or are they new?
What is the substrate in the tank?
What hiding spots are available for the smaller fish to get away?
In general, I dont think that a darter ever died from eating too much... too little, sometimes... too much, I just don't buy it.
Either write something worth reading or do something worth writing. - Benjamin Franklin
#3
Guest_Holstonriv22_*
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Posted 19 March 2012 - 05:54 PM
I checked on the species in the area but not collecting guidelines. I will make sure to read up before I go out again.
The tank was setup about 2 weeks ago with 2 new canister filters on each end.
The tank is made up of pea gravel and river rock. I have a few hiding spots but probably could use more hiding spots. There are areas for the darters to hide but mostly bigger openings for bigger darters.
I didn't think eating too much was the problem, but I couldn't think of anything else.
Again I'll make sure to look into collecting in my area and make sure to not break any laws.
Thanks in advance
The tank was setup about 2 weeks ago with 2 new canister filters on each end.
The tank is made up of pea gravel and river rock. I have a few hiding spots but probably could use more hiding spots. There are areas for the darters to hide but mostly bigger openings for bigger darters.
I didn't think eating too much was the problem, but I couldn't think of anything else.
Again I'll make sure to look into collecting in my area and make sure to not break any laws.
Thanks in advance
#4
Guest_EricaWieser_*
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Posted 19 March 2012 - 06:01 PM
There's the problem.The tank was setup about 2 weeks ago with 2 new canister filters on each end.
When fish food is added to an aquarium, the proteins in it degrade into ammonia. Ammonia (NH3) is toxic at very small concentrations, even at one or two parts per million (ppm). In the wild, nitrosomonas bacteria eat the ammonia and excrete nitrite (NO2), which is less toxic. Then a second type of bacteria called nitrospira bacteria eat the nitrite and excrete nitrate (NO3). Nitrate is much less toxic than ammonia and doesn't bother most fish until 30 or 40 ppm, although it depends on the species. It's much preferable to have each individual nitrogen atom in the form of NO3 than in the form of NH3. New tanks lack a sufficient population of these beneficial bacteria, though, so until the population has enough time to rise to a high enough number to instantly convert the available ammonia, the ammonia will sit in the water column and increase in concentration. That is why many people complain of 'new tank syndrome', where in the first few months every fish they put in their tank dies, but after a while the tank calms down and the fish stay alive. The reason is the lack or presence of large numbers of beneficial bacteria.
If you don't mind, please check out slide 8 of this presentation: http://www.ag.auburn...on%20Design.pdf
You'll see that at day 14 the ammonia is near its highest concentration.
The filter is the home for the bacteria. The more surface area on the sponge in the filter, the more potential 'homes' for bacteria to move into. If after 40 days ammonia and nitrite are at 0 ppm, you can rest assured that the number of 'homes' available for your beneficial bacteria is high enough. If after 40 days there are still ammonia and nitrite present, then you might want to increase the filtering capacity of the tank.
If you can buy a test kit for ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate, it would help you keep the rest of your fish alive. Then do water changes with dechlorinated water to keep ammonia and nitrite at 0 ppm. It'll take another 26 days, but eventually all the nitrogenous waste will be in the form of nitrate. At that point you only need to do water changes to keep nitrate below about 30 or 40 ppm.
More info: http://www.fishkeepi...ing-article.htm
Adding a live plant will help because they love to eat ammonium as they grow.
More info: http://theaquariumwi...ical_Filtration
It would also help to get the sponge from a filter of a friend who has an established tank. That sponge has lots of living beneficial bacteria on it. If you keep it wet with dechlorinated water during transfer and bring it over to your filter, it'll 'seed' your tank and your ammonia concentration will decrease.
Edited by EricaWieser, 19 March 2012 - 06:16 PM.
#5
Guest_Holstonriv22_*
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Posted 19 March 2012 - 06:06 PM
Thanks a lot. I will look into that. I was planning on doing a water change tonight.
#6
Guest_jblaylock_*
Guest_jblaylock_*
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Posted 20 March 2012 - 02:13 PM
http://www.eregulati...nessee/fishing/
Page 36-37. You should really read that.
Also,
http://forum.nanfa.o...anges-for-2010/
Page 36-37. You should really read that.
Also,
http://forum.nanfa.o...anges-for-2010/
#7
Guest_EricaWieser_*
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Posted 20 March 2012 - 02:24 PM
"Bait fish that are not listed in Section 1 or 2 above and are not listed by proclamation as endangered, threatened, or in need of management may be harvested by licensed sport anglers for use as bait with the following restrictions: 1) they shall only be used in the water from which they were harvested; 2) they shall not be possessed away from the waters from which they were harvested..."
Woah. So you can't keep any fish but the 10-ish species that are listed in sections 1 and 2? No native fish aquariums?
#8
Guest_fundulus_*
Guest_fundulus_*
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Posted 20 March 2012 - 02:47 PM
Yes, Tennessee shut down any legal collecting of fish for aquariums unless you have a bait license, or a scientific collecting permit.
#9
Guest_Casper_*
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Posted 20 March 2012 - 04:07 PM
Ain't that grand.
TWRA still allows one to raise cockroaches and mosquitos. Maybe earthworms with a permit.
Still though, getting in the water and watching a River Chub build a nest gives great satisfaction. And the use of cameras is challenging. Lots of clear water in the most diverse state.
Holstonriv22... being you are in K-Town several other NANFA members are near you. I will be hosting a gathering in early June ( Chattanooga ) on TN's Free Fishing Day. We will be pulling up seines of fish on Saturday and snorkeling Sunday. I will post the invite on the forum after Mike's Swamp Fever Trip into South Georgia. That would be a good opportunity to learn and experience more.
Casper
TWRA still allows one to raise cockroaches and mosquitos. Maybe earthworms with a permit.
Still though, getting in the water and watching a River Chub build a nest gives great satisfaction. And the use of cameras is challenging. Lots of clear water in the most diverse state.
Holstonriv22... being you are in K-Town several other NANFA members are near you. I will be hosting a gathering in early June ( Chattanooga ) on TN's Free Fishing Day. We will be pulling up seines of fish on Saturday and snorkeling Sunday. I will post the invite on the forum after Mike's Swamp Fever Trip into South Georgia. That would be a good opportunity to learn and experience more.
Casper
#10
Guest_fundulus_*
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Posted 20 March 2012 - 05:10 PM
Casper, do you know what day is the Free Fishing Day?
#11
Guest_steve_*
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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:20 PM
Do you know if the free fishing day is for instate residents only or is it open to out-of-staters also? If I happen to be off that weekend and can afford the gas, I might try to make it for that. From all that I've heard, seen, and read, a chance to see some of Tennessee's fish and learn from, and snorkel with the Snorkelmeister is an opportunity one wouldn't want to pass up.Holstonriv22... being you are in K-Town several other NANFA members are near you. I will be hosting a gathering in early June ( Chattanooga ) on TN's Free Fishing Day. We will be pulling up seines of fish on Saturday and snorkeling Sunday. I will post the invite on the forum after Mike's Swamp Fever Trip into South Georgia. That would be a good opportunity to learn and experience more.
Casper
Steve
#12
Guest_jblaylock_*
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Posted 20 March 2012 - 07:48 PM
Also, being in Knoxville, you are close to KY and VA and both of those states allow collecting of non listed fish. However, transporting back to TN and proving that you didn't catch them in the state of TN is another dilemia.
But, don't let this keep you from enjoying and learning about NA's Native fish. There are alternatives.
But, don't let this keep you from enjoying and learning about NA's Native fish. There are alternatives.
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