I agree with you about the trout, Ed.

But I think it would actually take a long while though to start off an all PA brook trout strain in hatcheries. We don't have THAT many, due to over fishing and exotic trout. I forget where I read it, but somewhere it said that brown trout are actually getting into native brook trout streams, out competing them, naturally reproducing on their own, and basically kicking them out.

Our native trout are beautiful. I have caught a few juveniles before on rod and reel and while seining, and they're just amazing. And as you said, they are our state fish. You think more would go into protecting them, stocking them, and having our streams known as great brook trout fishing to draw in the money. Now they're starting off a program of stocking along the lines of larger, but fewer. I don't know what's worse...a bigger trout with a bigger appetite, or many, smaller trout with an appetite.

Also while trout fishing, I've seen many anglers actually get frustrated catching suckers and creek chubs, that they just casually kill them everytime they catch them. Yeah, like that's going to help.

Before I was a teenager, I went to a friends house about an hour away, and we got the great idea to stock the local trout stream with bluegill, bass, perch, catfish, and anything else we could catch in a farm pond. Now I know that was a pretty bad idea, but at the time it seemed fun. They're native, and more fun to catch than trout. The opening day of trout, people were catching bluegills left and right, and they were all discouraged and left. Random story, but it shows how much people want to catch trout, not just go fishing for the simple fun and enjoyment. I guess until the day people don't want to trout fish, they're always going to be stocking exotics.

Although, a few years ago there was something like a mercury break out in hatchery raised fish, and a lot of people stopped fishing for them. I know I did. Maybe we should start a fake scare just to get people to stop...


I've read through the booklet about fishing laws they give you every year about 100 times. They don't seem that hard to follow. What does bother me though is every watershed has different regulations. Are their other laws written somewhere else or something?

I certainly don't think that stocking exotics is a good thing either but I do think there is great value in preserving local stocks. A great example would be if there is a new disease that arises and whipes out all of the northern strian brook trout and for some odd reason some of the southern strains are resistant to this new disease. We now still have brook trout around. I know this is a very simplified and unlikely scenario but you get the point. In my opinion the only reason any fish should EVER be stocked is to aid in the recovery of an extirpated or depleted population and brood stock from as close as possible to the stocking site should be used to propigate these fish being stocked in the area. A lot of damage can be done by stocking fish even if they are the same species as what occurs in the area to be stocked if these stocked fish are not of the same genetic strain. I was certainly in no way saying the exotic browns and rainbows were a good thing but I think Dave just was trying to look at the bright side, I realy don't think he would say stocking any non-native was a good idea either.

Oh, and Teleost, I'm sorry for contributing to the derailing of your thread. Maybe you could work some admin magic and split the thread into two or something along those lines.

Oh, and Teleost, I'm sorry for contributing to the derailing of your thread. Maybe you could work some admin magic and split the thread into two or something along those lines.

Thank you for your concerns Slasher but tangents are a natural in conversations. I see good derails and bad derails....This is a good one. I might suggest a new topic on non native trout but it's not all that important.

I'll add to the derail also.....I don't think states should participate in any stocking of any fish ever. If a fish is in trouble, they could easily spend money they would usually allocate for stocking on closing areas to sport fishing for a period of time or better yet, place site specific rules not allowing possession of that particular fish from that body of water. If anglers love stocked LMB & trout so much, they should make giant concrete reservoirs with 12' high walls for pay lakes.

What does bother me though is every watershed has different regulations.

That is a major part of my point. It's not like there are a couple of special streams or lakes, like in Ohio, but nearly every doggone stream in Pennsylvania is regulated differently. It's so @#$@^$# confusing. It makes it preferable to drive to Ohio to fish.

If a fish is in trouble, they could easily spend money they would usually allocate for stocking on closing areas to sport fishing for a period of time or better yet, place site specific rules not allowing possession of that particular fish from that body of water.

That is how we got the undecipherable, myriad of complexities, laws in Pennsylvania in the first place. It's nuts! There's got to be a better way. Protecting endangered species should not mean that every stream, or even different reaches of the same stream, should have its own laws. Just protect the species and punish violators.

That is how we got the undecipherable, myriad of complexities, laws in Pennsylvania in the first place. It's nuts! There's got to be a better way. Protecting endangered species should not mean that every stream, or even different reaches of the same stream, should have its own laws. Just protect the species and punish violators

The rules become complex due to good management. When officials get lazy they just put blanket law for the entire state. If one fish becomes threatened in one stream do you suggest that species should be off limits statewide to make it easy to understand the rules?

Ok Ed, so I forgot exactly how bad the rules are. The stream infront of my house, I can't go out there and play around and collect until trout season starts, starting in 2 days. But, if I go down the stream about 1 mile, I can do all the collecting I want. That area is also a big time trout fishing hole. Then like another 20 miles upstream, it's artificial baits only. And this goes for a lot of areas. It's not so much the kinds of fish you can or can't catch, it's the types of fishing you can do. I completly forgot about that. This is why I don't go to these places. There's also extended seasons and closed seasons for trout in different waters. And to make it worse, some southern counties get a 2 week early first day of trout than the rest of the state.

I agree with the makings of new lakes and what not for just those fish. They should just be spring fed and have no possible way of coming in contact with other streams. Yeah, and just load it up with some goldfish and golden shiners to keep a baitfish population. But I think if a fish does need a little help with stocking, hell why not. It's just not necessary to pay all the money they do for the trout and bass.

The rules become complex due to good management. When officials get lazy they just put blanket law for the entire state. If one fish becomes threatened in one stream do you suggest that species should be off limits statewide to make it easy to understand the rules?

Uland, I can't disagree with you. But when the laws become so complex as to be impossible to understand, they become meaningless. We have nearly reached that point, and yet they keep adding more laws.

Okay, so here it is, from the Pennsylvania Fish and Boat Commission's Trout Stocking Index web page
http://sites.state.p..._Boat/stock.htm

Summary for 2007
Brook = 559,100
Brown = 921,240
Rainbow = 1,939,260 (inc. 8,900 trophy golden)
PFBC Total = 3,296,100
Contracted = 123,500
Coop. Nurs. = 1,067,000
Total to be Stocked = 4,486,600

That's right, nearly four and a half million trout! And yes, a small fraction will be native brook trout. But the overwhelming majority will be exotic trout species. Fortunately, most will be fished out in a short time and won't remain in the streams and lakes.

Rainbow trout don't live too well out in the wild in PA, but the brown trout sometimes do, which can cause problems. Those "Golden Trout" won't last long, even shorter than the regular rainbow. I've been thinking about taking my limit in trout everyday possible just to cut down the population, but I don't care for the taste of them. I went to the trout kickoff last week...which is just an outdoors expo here, and there's about 5 different clubs/associations that want more trout stocked and they're basically dedicated to exotic trout. It drove me nuts. I did, however, join a watershed organization which is based around a native trout stream and a lake, dedicated to preserving the area and keeping construction to a minimum.

Those "Golden Trout" won't last long, even shorter than the regular rainbow. I've been thinking about taking my limit in trout everyday possible just to cut down the population, but I don't care for the taste of them.

About that taste. Telico river in Tennessee. Stocked and fished heavily. Purina Trout chow. I like fish that taste like fish, not dogs. Although I cant say I have ever eaten a dog to compare. Those fish taste so terrible I just quit going there. Native Brookies I used to catch in Canada fight inch for inch ten times better than stocked rainbows which is like reeling in a piece of 2x4. And the taste. Well on the bank of the stream, camp stove, frying pan, oil, with a little salt and pepper man if you never hadum you are missing a treat. So ya I agree on the taste thing. I think it applies to all fish that are stocked heavily and weekly like the Telico River in the area where you have to buy a daily permit on top of your regular trout stamp on top of you regular fishing liscence. THEY CAN HAVE THEIR PURINA TROUT, YUCK.

This is very true. Stocked trout are terrible tasting, though holdover stockers that have been in the water over a year taste much like their wild counterparts. I love to eat trout. But I have lost all interest in eating or fishing for stockers. They are sorry fish that tend to mill around in deep holes chasing anything that dimples the surface. They have had everything that makes a trout a trout bred out of them. The trout chow makes their flesh taste like liver.
Streambred trout are fantastic tasting in my opinion, and a worthy gamefish.