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I Live on the West Coast, first time Darters owner. (Pics)


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#21 osburni

osburni
  • NANFA Member
  • Greenbrier Valley, West Virginia

Posted 03 February 2016 - 06:48 PM

My fish must be weird. I have a tank with 3 variegates, 10 rainbows, 1 fantail, and 4 mountain redbelly dace.  The variegates definitely rule the roost especially at feeding time. When I put the turkey baster full of bloodworms in the tank the variegates are pecking at the end of the tube waiting for the worms.  My biggest concern is making sure the others get fed without the variegates getting it all.  The fish in this tank are all fat and healthy and have been together with no losses or additions for over a year, but they seem to have developed a rather odd pecking order.

The dace don't even come out from under the rocks half of the time anymore. They're mostly active after dark.  I'm actually setting up a new tank for the dace and plan on adding about a dozen more so they can have a big school.  The ones I have were caught out of a school of hundreds and I'm thinking they need to be around more of there own kind. 



#22 Josh Blaylock

Josh Blaylock
  • Board of Directors
  • Central Kentucky

Posted 03 February 2016 - 06:58 PM



The dace don't even come out from under the rocks half of the time anymore. They're mostly active after dark.  I'm actually setting up a new tank for the dace and plan on adding about a dozen more so they can have a big school.  The ones I have were caught out of a school of hundreds and I'm thinking they need to be around more of there own kind. 


I'd say add more dace and maybe some shiners. Dace like to school.


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Josh Blaylock - Central KY
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I hope to have God on my side, but I must have Kentucky.

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#23 osburni

osburni
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  • Greenbrier Valley, West Virginia

Posted 03 February 2016 - 07:26 PM

I'd say add more dace and maybe some shiners. Dace like to school.


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I agree. That's what I'm working on.



#24 Cv89

Cv89
  • NANFA Guest
  • CA

Posted 04 February 2016 - 12:29 AM

Wow you east coasters are so damm lucky, wish I can snorkel with these fishes every weekend.

A noob question but does selling native fishes require a special license? Because aside from the vendors listed on here, I can't find these guys in any stores or online; eBay, Aquabid.

#25 Josh Blaylock

Josh Blaylock
  • Board of Directors
  • Central Kentucky

Posted 04 February 2016 - 07:48 AM

A noob question but does selling native fishes require a special license? Because aside from the vendors listed on here, I can't find these guys in any stores or online; eBay, Aquabid.

 

I think for the most part, yes.  All states are different though, and Aquabid could have questionable sellers.


Josh Blaylock - Central KY
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KYCREEKS - KRWW - KWA



I hope to have God on my side, but I must have Kentucky.

- Abraham Lincoln, 1861


#26 littlen

littlen
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  • Washington, D.C.

Posted 04 February 2016 - 09:28 AM

You can get most of what you're looking for from the vendors listed here.  Otherwise, a lot of NANFAns are happy to give away their unwanted, local, native pets.  I think I've heard CA has some interesting/unfortunate rules about bringing in natives from out-of-state?....unless purchased?


It might be more convenient in the long run for you to just move east.  :cool2:


Nick L.

#27 gerald

gerald
  • Global Moderator
  • Wake Forest, North Carolina

Posted 04 February 2016 - 12:13 PM

Many states allow you to collect non-game fish ("bait") for personal use only with a regular fishing license.  If you want to SELL wild-caught fish, in most places you need to get a commercial bait license from your state fishery agency.  If you collect wild fish, breed them in aquaria, and sell offspring, that's often a "gray area" in the law as to whether you need a license or not.  Ask the agencies.

 

Nick L wrote:  " It might be more convenient in the long run for you to just move east."

 

Yeah but he might not want to abandon CA's truly awesome herp diversity.


Gerald Pottern
-----------------------
Hangin' on the Neuse
"Taxonomy is the diaper used to organize the mess of evolution into discrete packages" - M.Sandel


#28 littlen

littlen
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  • Washington, D.C.

Posted 04 February 2016 - 01:07 PM

2 great points, Gerald.


Nick L.

#29 Cv89

Cv89
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  • CA

Posted 04 February 2016 - 01:51 PM

"You can get most of what you're looking for from the vendors listed here. Otherwise, a lot of NANFAns are happy to give away their unwanted, local, native pets."

That'll be sweet. There was definitely a few darters I want that weren't available on the vendor's list. If any of your old darters need a new home please let me know I'll be happy to pay for the shipping. That is while CA still has water.

#30 littlen

littlen
  • NANFA Member
  • Washington, D.C.

Posted 04 February 2016 - 03:02 PM

What kind are you looking for?


Nick L.

#31 Cv89

Cv89
  • NANFA Guest
  • CA

Posted 04 February 2016 - 03:40 PM

I was looking for some Redline and Kanawha darters. I think Sachs Aquaculture offered the redlines but they're out of stock and trust me I refresh that page every other day hoping one day it'll says in stock lol.

Edited by Cv89, 04 February 2016 - 03:45 PM.


#32 littlen

littlen
  • NANFA Member
  • Washington, D.C.

Posted 05 February 2016 - 07:24 AM

Redlines you say?  A most excellent choice.  You are actually talking to a huge Redline enthusiast despite my avatar--a Gilt darter. (Think of an early 60's, Beatles, fan-girl, screaming at a young Paul McCartney.  That's me when I catch a big, flashy male).

I currently keep a dozen or so and I am typically in Redline country a few times a year.  I won't be until Fall as I just had a new addition to the family and he's not old enough to be of much help with a dipnet yet.  If you're unable to source any until then, we can keep in touch and possibly work something out at that time.  

I'm 1 for 3 on trips to Kanawha country.  I'd love to have a few more, but they've been harder to come across--in VA anyway.  I think some NC folks have a better time finding them.

 

 

 

 

EDIT: I just shamed myself into changing my avatar.  


Nick L.

#33 gerald

gerald
  • Global Moderator
  • Wake Forest, North Carolina

Posted 05 February 2016 - 11:24 AM

Nick - have you found kanawhae to be any more reliable at adapting to aquarium life than variegate darters (notwithstanding osburni's peculiar group) ?   I've only kept kanawhae once, 15+ yrs ago, and had them gradually get thin and weak over several months.  Multiple feedings per day may be the key -- Osburni what do you think?


Gerald Pottern
-----------------------
Hangin' on the Neuse
"Taxonomy is the diaper used to organize the mess of evolution into discrete packages" - M.Sandel


#34 Josh Blaylock

Josh Blaylock
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  • Central Kentucky

Posted 05 February 2016 - 11:28 AM

Redlines you say?  A most excellent choice.  You are actually talking to a huge Redline enthusiast despite my avatar--a Gilt darter. (Think of an early 60's, Beatles, fan-girl, screaming at a young Paul McCartney.  That's me when I catch a big, flashy male).
 

 

I like them too

https://youtu.be/SAdEheuc5sM

 

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Josh Blaylock - Central KY
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KYCREEKS - KRWW - KWA



I hope to have God on my side, but I must have Kentucky.

- Abraham Lincoln, 1861


#35 Cv89

Cv89
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  • CA

Posted 05 February 2016 - 01:38 PM

@ littlen, thanks. Yea those redlines really stand out from other darters with their checkered design. Hopefully I don't change interests in fish species any time soon. I don't have much resources aside from you guys on the forum so please keep me updated thanks.

#36 littlen

littlen
  • NANFA Member
  • Washington, D.C.

Posted 05 February 2016 - 02:56 PM

Josh--those Redlines have a lot of black.  Check out this one from a friend's tank.  Zero red in him, or yellow for that matter!  You can see a small portion of dorsal fin a typical Redline in the bottom right corner for comparison.  

 

Attached File  blackredline.jpg   70.87KB   2 downloads

 

Gerald--I haven't kept Candy's but would guess they are very very similar to Kanawha's as far as how they'd do in captivity.  I got my Kanawha last Fall.  He's doing great and competes very well with a lot of much more food aggressive species.  I feed my tank once a day, but slam it full of blackworms, or a mysis/bloodworm combo.  Haven't seen any 'withering away' at all.  I believe Derek has had similar results with Variegates slowly declining.  I've never kept them but am curious to see if my ~3 months in quarantine---which also allows them time to adjust to captivity in a less competitive feeding environment----gives them the skills they need to survive in my highly competitive 150.

Additionally, where I saw Kanawhas and Candys in the wild, they had [what appeared to be] very little competition from neighboring species of darters, or even shiners for that matter.  So I think it is fair to say that even mild competition throws them off their feeding.  Redlines, on the otherhand are a very feisty feeder in streams with lots of other darter/shiner species which makes them excellent additions to a community stream tank.

I've gotten sub-adult/adult Bandeds and Greensides that have failed to thrive once I brought them home.  However, I have 1 Greenside and 2 Bandeds that were all ~1" when I collected them and are thriving in the 150.  I also attribute that to having the time to adapt to captivity and learning to be a little more aggressive feeders and less flighty than they usually are in the wild.

I would really like to try my hand at some Variegates to see if my long acclimation to captivity helps, or if they're just poor specimens to keep in captivity in general.  Maybe we aren't providing them with something obvious?  (Much to the same tune that oceanic species like tuna, mahi, and Great white & Tiger sharks historically failed in captivity before we realized vertical walls were the enemy).

 

If anyone wants me to explore my theory of Variegates in captivity with a prolonged introduction in a QX tank, I'm happy to receive an early xmas gift!  :biggrin:


Nick L.

#37 osburni

osburni
  • NANFA Member
  • Greenbrier Valley, West Virginia

Posted 05 February 2016 - 07:54 PM

Maybe the fact that my Variegates (and Rainbows) are introduced might have something to do with their different behaviors.  They were caught in the same stream in the Lower New River Gorge area of WV.  They're a fairly recent introduction but are now common and are apparently adapting well enough to hybridize candy darters out of existence in some areas.






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