Carp discussion

I think you would have to try pretty hard to do the damage of a million carp in ten years in just one human day.

Though a million carp would be difficult to compete with in a single day I think giving us 10 years is a bit much. We do a lot of damage, heck...collecting, something we somehow view as a good thing does a lot of damage.

What are you doing in one day? Joy-riding 747's? Dumping toxic waste? Out competing native sucker (and others) by taking their food source/habitat?

I think you would have to try pretty hard to do the damage of a million carp in ten years in just one human day.

Lets see, I wake up in my heated and air conditioned house. Take a shower, go down to check on the fish. So far today I have already burned a dinosuar or two. Go outside fire up my F250 Diesel, Cloud of smoke, go to the lumberyard and pick up 100 2x4's. Drive to my jobsite, run powertools all day. Head home, use deadly chemicals to build myself another tank, which will consume more energy. Cook dinner, sit on the computer.
Every thing I do consumes energy, that is not being directly returned to the earth. In fact the energy I consume is polluting the very air I breathe.
What of the carp? They eat, they crap. They immediately return their used energy back to the environment in the form of fertilizer, which is imediately reused. I have stepped way outside of this basic cycle, and when a carp dies his body is utilized by something. When I die I will be shot full of so much embalming fluid that my body is poison to any organism that tries to use it.
The carp consumed nothing that was not returned. We are living on borrowed time. We are living on millions of years of stored energy. Without this fossil fuel energy we WILL have a mass die off of humans.
Think of it this way, The sun is THE energy source. An acre of grass can only support one cow. Add fertilizers(produced by petroleum) and this acre can support two cows. What happens without the stored petroleum? one cow dies. We are living off of millions of years of stored "sunlight" and our population has grown into this consumption, What happens when it is gone.
Sorry for the rant.

Lets see, I wake up in my heated and air conditioned house. Take a shower, go down to check on the fish. So far today I have already burned a dinosuar or two. Go outside fire up my F250 Diesel, Cloud of smoke, go to the lumberyard and pick up 100 2x4's. Drive to my jobsite, run powertools all day. Head home, use deadly chemicals to build myself another tank, which will consume more energy. Cook dinner, sit on the computer.
Every thing I do consumes energy, that is not being directly returned to the earth. In fact the energy I consume is polluting the very air I breathe.
What of the carp? They eat, they crap. They immediately return their used energy back to the environment in the form of fertilizer, which is imediately reused. I have stepped way outside of this basic cycle, and when a carp dies his body is utilized by something. When I die I will be shot full of so much embalming fluid that my body is poison to any organism that tries to use it.
The carp consumed nothing that was not returned. We are living on borrowed time. We are living on millions of years of stored energy. Without this fossil fuel energy we WILL have a mass die off of humans.
Think of it this way, The sun is THE energy source. An acre of grass can only support one cow. Add fertilizers(produced by petroleum) and this acre can support two cows. What happens without the stored petroleum? one cow dies. We are living off of millions of years of stored "sunlight" and our population has grown into this consumption, What happens when it is gone.
Sorry for the rant.

Not to mention all the food you ate and the damage done from the places that it comes from.

I'm glad a few people see my point.

When it comes to negative environmental impacts, if carp are the devil, human beings are the devil X 10.

I'm glad a few people see my point.

When it comes to negative environmental impacts, if carp are the devil, human beings are the devil X 10.

I don't think anyone denys our impact on the environment, it's just that we cannot go around killing people as if they were carp.

I don't think anyone denys our impact on the environment, it's just that we cannot go around killing people as if they were carp.

Yeah, I have checked with local regulations on that, and you are correct, I cannot kill people. Though I am looking for a loophole.

I don't think anyone denys our impact on the environment, it's just that we cannot go around killing people as if they were carp.

I don't know.....sounded like a few on here were a little skiddish about admiting our impact on the environment just because they hate carp with a passion. I know we can't go around killing people like carp. But maybe skipjack will find that loophole .

I don't know.....sounded like a few on here were a little skiddish about admiting our impact on the environment just because they hate carp with a passion. I know we can't go around killing people like carp. But maybe skipjack will find that loophole .

I sorta noticed that as well but I think in the end everyone realizes it. It's just knowone like to admit that they are part of the problem, especially people who care so much about the environment. Carp are a problem we created for our waters, we should take care of that problem but remember that they are here because of us (brooklamprey will get angry at the "us" part) and should not have to suffer a cruel death for a human mistake.

I don't know.....sounded like a few on here were a little skiddish about admiting our impact on the environment just because they hate carp with a passion. I know we can't go around killing people like carp. But maybe skipjack will find that loophole .

I do not think anyone here.. commenting on this topic deny human impact on the Enviornment.
This however is not the topic of this post.

The topic of this post is a species of biological pollution that needs cleaned up.

Thing about humans is that you can reason with them. You can talk with and educate them about what their destructive behaviors are doing and there can actually be a resulting change in those behaviors.

Try this sometime with a carp.......Trust me I tried it once and it really does not work well. You can yell at them to stop and they just keep right on grubbing the substrate and spreading silt all over the spawning group of Banded killies eggs nearby.

They do not reason and they do not stop being the pollution that they are. Said it once and I'll say it again. These fish need to be put under control and eradicated in areas if practical.

Carp are a problem we created for our waters, we should take care of that problem but remember that they are here because of us (brooklamprey will get angry at the "us" part) and should not have to suffer a cruel death for a human mistake.

So these Asian and European imported species destroying our local Flora and Fauna should be coddled and hugged because some morons thought it was cool to release them?

"It's not there fault" is a rather lame excuse for not dealing with an issue and a problem.

So these Asian and European imported species destroying our local Flora and Fauna should be coddled and hugged because some morons thought it was cool to release them?

If you consider a blow to the head as being coddled and hugged then yes, coddle and hug away. I just see no reason to let something sufficate, you could just as easily smack a rock against it's head. Killing something quickly is not a hard concept to grasp. Maybe you have some kind of sick vendetta against carp that brings you sick joy to watch them die, in that case I guess I cannot argue with you.

"It's not there fault" is a rather lame excuse for not dealing with an issue and a problem.

I'm getting tired of you twisting words around. You know I don't want carp in our waters, you know none of us do and yet you make it look like we're trying to put them on the protected species list or something. Maybe you need to read the posts a bit more slowely to grasp that killing something humainly isen't the same as letting it remain a problem.

read the posts a bit more slowely

Good advice...Please Re-Read post #37 as well as the rest of this thread yourself and stop banging a dead horse....

Who is saying anything about torture except for a few that keep bringing this up where it does not exist?

Alright! Carp haters unite! No one, and I mean no one is inhumanely killing carp on this forum. No body here would do that! The people you are after Sandtiger are not here. Brook does not kill anything and watch it die without feeling sad for the loss of life. But he is able to justify it. Nobody here is a sadist. nobody here wants to watch a carp expire from lack of oxygen. Get a grip on this, most of us remove carp , but none of us torture them! If your reasoning for this assumption is the earlier posted carp with a leatherman in its side, I can assure you that, that was only for effect, as I personally bludgeoned it with a rock first.

let's take it easy here, folks... we are all arguing over the nuances of the same side of the argument. Let's please try to keep this a friendly topic (not that it's getting bad, but I could see it quickly degenerating). Tone is very difficult to inperpret over the internet.

Good advice...Please Re-Read post #37 as well as the rest of this thread yourself and stop banging a dead horse....

Who is saying anything about torture except for a few that keep bringing this up where it does not exist?

I didn't bring it up this time around, element did in post...what was it? 23? I didn't even mention the humain killing of carp until last night, shortly before you decided to chime in with your typically bad attitude. and all I said was the following...

Carp are a problem we created for our waters, we should take care of that problem but remember that they are here because of us (brooklamprey will get angry at the "us" part) and should not have to suffer a cruel death for a human mistake.

I wasen't pointing fingers at anyone, it was just a reminder to anyone who reads this, then you come here gun's blazing and had to take this debate to yet another level, accusing me of "coddleing the carp" and not wanting to deal with the problem when I addressed, clear as day, that carp don't belong in our waters. So really, who's beating the dead horse?

Alright! Carp haters unite! No one, and I mean no one is inhumanely killing carp on this forum. No body here would do that! The people you are after Sandtiger are not here.

Point out to me PLEASE where I said anyone on this forum was killing carp inhumanely. Granted, I made an angry comment about brook watching them die but that's just the way he comes across. Anytime someone mentions the idea of a quick death he seems to get uptight and angry, as if it's the same as letting them live.

Brook does not kill anything and watch it die without feeling sad for the loss of life. But he is able to justify it.

He sure dosen't come across that way. In fact, he seems to think that anyone who wants them kiled humainly is some kind of carp hugger.

If your reasoning for this assumption is the earlier posted carp with a leatherman in its side, I can assure you that, that was only for effect, as I personally bludgeoned it with a rock first.

Yeah, I'm fully aware of that. Pretty gross all the same, but I'll give you that at least it was dead.

Point out to me PLEASE where I said anyone on this forum was killing carp inhumanely. Granted, I made an angry comment about brook watching them die but that's just the way he comes across. Anytime someone mentions the idea of a quick death he seems to get uptight and angry, as if it's the same as letting them live.

Sandtiger,

You didn't accuse any individual specifically of torturing carp but you said:

If you consider a blow to the head as being coddled and hugged then yes, coddle and hug away. icon_rolleyes.gif I just see no reason to let something sufficate, you could just as easily smack a rock against it's head. Killing something quickly is not a hard concept to grasp. Maybe you have some kind of sick vendetta against carp that brings you sick joy to watch them die, in that case I guess I cannot argue with you.

In this post you imply people on this forum fail to kill carp in a humane way (and even seek joy in torture). I would like to remind you this accusation is particularly offensive to me. I can't find a single mention of anyone (including Brooklamprey) allowing carp to suffocate or die in an otherwise humane way. I would also like to add that accusing Brooklamprey of some "sick vendetta" seeking joy in "watching them die" is irritating me. You've not been called a "carp hugger" either. Please take your strange Brooklamprey vendetta elsewhere.

Please take your strange Brooklamprey vendetta elsewhere.

Gladly, I imagine I'll be the first of many.

I brought up the inhumane topic a while back because someone in the thread had mentioned just throwing the carp in the woods. Otherwise I wouldn't have said a thing on this thread. I also never accused any individual on this thread of doing this. I just said this should not be done because it is disrespectful. I just read the original carp thread that was closed a while back and realized that sandtiger had pretty much summed up the same way I feel about the subject. If I had known this earlier, I wouldn't have continued to "beat a dead horse".

I think I got my main point across about giving the carp a quick, humane death. I think we all agree on this main issue, but people keep nit picking at little things that others have said in the thread.

No hard feelings fellas.

Since no one is willing to stop arguing over the same things and going back and forth, I'm closing yet another carp thread.

From the outside looking in, it appears people are taking generalizations too far. No one is accusing anyone directly about doing anything. We all believe that carp are bad and should be taken care of. It is obvious that people are emotional when it comes to invasives and we all have varying experiences when dealing with them.

See Forum Guideline #1.

I would also like to add that I know teleost didn't mean for you to leave the forum, but instead take your discussion with him offline.