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Saluda, NC


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#21 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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  • Pigeon Watershed, North Carolina

Posted 04 September 2016 - 10:15 AM

 

Eastern blacknose dace (atratulus) is supposedly in the Roanoke basin and northward.  The New (Kanawha),Yadkin, Santee (Catawba, Broad, Saluda), Savannah, Tennessee, and Gulf drainage populations should all be Western (obtusus) according to recent genetic studies.  Separating them visually is pretty near hopeless; both are quite variable in appearance.  I imagine they'd be very susceptible to "headwater stream capture" between drainage basins, and bait bucket transport in areas where their ranges are close.  I'm guessing Dustin's ID of "western" is based only on location, right?

 

Molecular Phylogenetics of the Eastern and Western Blacknose Dace, Rhinichthys atratulus and R. obtusus (Teleostei: Cyprinidae). Michelle Kraczkowski and Barry Chernoff.  Copeia Jun 2014 : Vol. 2014, Issue 2, pg(s) 325-338 doi: 10.1643/CG-14-002.   http://www.bioone.or....1643/CG-14-002
 

 

Gotcha, guess that makes sense. Thanks Gerald.



#22 Dustin

Dustin
  • Forum Staff

Posted 04 September 2016 - 03:11 PM

You got mainly creek chubs there.  17 looks like a Nocomis of some sort, either bluehead or river and the catfish may be a baby flathead, but that is just a wild guess.


Dustin Smith
At the convergence of the Broad, Saluda and Congaree
Lexington, SC


#23 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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  • Pigeon Watershed, North Carolina

Posted 04 September 2016 - 07:07 PM

You got mainly creek chubs there.  17 looks like a Nocomis of some sort, either bluehead or river and the catfish may be a baby flathead, but that is just a wild guess.

K, I think I caught a Santee or Blotched Chub, will post the pics later. Beat ugh.



#24 Matt DeLaVega

Matt DeLaVega
  • Forum Staff
  • Ohio

Posted 04 September 2016 - 07:29 PM

You got mainly creek chubs there.  17 looks like a Nocomis of some sort, either bluehead or river and the catfish may be a baby flathead, but that is just a wild guess.

I would be surprised to see a juvenile flathead that small this time of year. YOY in Ohio are typically 3+ inches by now an I would guess they would be larger down that way. I have no idea except for size. Flatheads spawn earlier than blue and channel from my understanding.


The member formerly known as Skipjack


#25 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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  • Pigeon Watershed, North Carolina

Posted 05 September 2016 - 10:25 AM

I would be surprised to see a juvenile flathead that small this time of year. YOY in Ohio are typically 3+ inches by now an I would guess they would be larger down that way. I have no idea except for size. Flatheads spawn earlier than blue and channel from my understanding.

It's either a Margined Madtom or some sort of Bullhead. I caught a few all around the same size and they all had black outlining around the tail and dorsal fin but you could barely see it.



#26 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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  • Pigeon Watershed, North Carolina

Posted 05 September 2016 - 10:42 AM

Last group of pics here, back from Saluda now. Think some may be Highback Chubs and possibly Santee Chubs. The latter had markings that I could see from above the water around its dorsal fin. Looked like two or three blotches on its back. Last+Ones+_1_+_Large_.JPG



#27 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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  • Pigeon Watershed, North Carolina

Posted 05 September 2016 - 10:43 AM

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#28 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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  • Pigeon Watershed, North Carolina

Posted 05 September 2016 - 10:43 AM

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#29 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
  • NANFA Member
  • Pigeon Watershed, North Carolina

Posted 05 September 2016 - 10:43 AM

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#30 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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  • Pigeon Watershed, North Carolina

Posted 05 September 2016 - 10:44 AM

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#31 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
  • NANFA Member
  • Pigeon Watershed, North Carolina

Posted 05 September 2016 - 10:44 AM

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#32 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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  • Pigeon Watershed, North Carolina

Posted 05 September 2016 - 10:44 AM

Last+Ones+_7_+_Large_.JPG



#33 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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  • Pigeon Watershed, North Carolina

Posted 05 September 2016 - 10:45 AM

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#34 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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  • Pigeon Watershed, North Carolina

Posted 05 September 2016 - 10:45 AM

Last+Ones+_9_+_Large_.JPG



#35 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
  • NANFA Member
  • Pigeon Watershed, North Carolina

Posted 05 September 2016 - 10:45 AM

Last+Ones+_10_+_Large_.JPG



#36 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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  • Pigeon Watershed, North Carolina

Posted 05 September 2016 - 10:45 AM

Last+Ones+_11_+_Large_.JPG



#37 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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Posted 05 September 2016 - 10:46 AM

This one looked very strange, no idea.Last+Ones+_12_+_Large_.JPG



#38 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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Posted 05 September 2016 - 10:47 AM

Last+Ones+_13_+_Large_.JPG



#39 gerald

gerald
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  • Wake Forest, North Carolina

Posted 05 September 2016 - 05:08 PM

This is Broad River basin, right?  assuming so, i'd guess:

26, 31, 32 = Notropis sp. cf. chlorocephalus (Broad River Greenhead)

27-29, 33-34 = Cyprinella labrosa or zanema, or maybe Hyb. rubrifrons?  

30, 38 = Cyprinella chloristia or nivea? (need better shot of snout shape)

35-36 = Hybopsis hypsinotus?  or H. rubrifrons (shouldn't be in Broad basin) ?

37 = Plain old creek chub, Semotilus atromac, of course!

 

Need Dustin & Fritz's input on the "chubs" other than creek chub (labrosa, zanema, hypsinotus, rubrifrons)


Gerald Pottern
-----------------------
Hangin' on the Neuse
"Taxonomy is the diaper used to organize the mess of evolution into discrete packages" - M.Sandel


#40 taldridge0321

taldridge0321
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  • Pigeon Watershed, North Carolina

Posted 05 September 2016 - 05:33 PM

This is Broad River basin, right?  assuming so, i'd guess:

26, 31, 32 = Notropis sp. cf. chlorocephalus (Broad River Greenhead)

27-29, 33-34 = Cyprinella labrosa or zanema, or maybe Hyb. rubrifrons?  

30, 38 = Cyprinella chloristia or nivea? (need better shot of snout shape)

35-36 = Hybopsis hypsinotus?  or H. rubrifrons (shouldn't be in Broad basin) ?

37 = Plain old creek chub, Semotilus atromac, of course!

 

Need Dustin & Fritz's input on the "chubs" other than creek chub (labrosa, zanema, hypsinotus, rubrifrons)

Yes sir Broad River Basin.





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