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Elassoma Gilberti

Started by Guest_Okiimiru_* , Aug 22 2010 01:19 PM

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1023 replies to this topic

#701 Guest_Usil_*

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Posted 04 October 2011 - 08:06 AM

Great news on the spawning. They must be tiny critters to see at an early age.

Usil

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#702 Guest_EricaWieser_*

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Posted 04 October 2011 - 08:18 AM

Yeah, when they hatch they're the size of a grain of sand. I don't expect to see them for a while, especially since I've got the filter running so they'll be hiding from the current deep in the plants. That's why I'm going to start feeding the tank with microworms now, now that I see spawning, instead of waiting until I see fry.

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#703 Guest_Usil_*

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Posted 04 October 2011 - 08:30 AM

Good idea. By the time you spot them half might be gone.

Usil

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#704 Guest_gerald_*

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Posted 04 October 2011 - 08:47 AM

Might add some shed tree leaves too - they will help to grow rotifers, paramecium, other micro-food bugs. Decaying leaves & stick piles are where you find baby pygmies in the wild.

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#705 Guest_EricaWieser_*

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Posted 04 October 2011 - 12:18 PM

Do you have any good tree species suggestions? I am aware that certain tree leaves are toxic and don't want to use the wrong ones.

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#706 Guest_gerald_*

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Posted 04 October 2011 - 01:58 PM

All the common deciduous hardwood trees around here are OK, soaked in water for a few days until they sink: Oaks, hickory, elm, ash, maple, sweetgum, etc. Also Southern magnolia (evergreen) but they need slightly longer soaking or you may get an oily film and/or stinky smell. Use brown shed leaves, not green ones off the tree. The convex shape of magnolia leaves make nice caves to hide under, and they last pretty long.

Do you have any good tree species suggestions? I am aware that certain tree leaves are toxic and don't want to use the wrong ones.

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#707 Guest_nativeplanter_*

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Posted 04 October 2011 - 02:20 PM

All the common deciduous hardwood trees around here are OK,

I would avoid leaves from anything in the genus Prunus. Otherwise, I think Gerald is right.

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#708 Michael Wolfe

Board of Directors

North Georgia, Oconee River Drainage

Posted 04 October 2011 - 06:10 PM

I would avoid leaves from anything in the genus Prunus. Otherwise, I think Gerald is right.

What about Pecan... I have that pretty much everywhere...

Either write something worth reading or do something worth writing. - Benjamin Franklin

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#709 Guest_nativeplanter_*

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Posted 05 October 2011 - 11:17 AM

I've used peacan before with no ill-effects. (As always, YMMV.)

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#710 Guest_EricaWieser_*

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 05:04 PM

I think I finally fixed the water cloudiness problem I've been having since July, when I added that awful Miracle Gro Organic Choice Potting Mix®. It had been getting cloudy to the point of being opaque every three days or so. So I topped it with an inch of kitty litter and this time, I think it worked. Here is the result and a few other pictures of the fish.

How the tank looks now

fishtank 10_06_2011 resize.jpg 163.13KB 0 downloads
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Fish panicking and huddling together after adding kitty litter

fish panicking together after adding kitty litter resize.jpg 235.08KB 0 downloads
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a female

picture.jpg 154.9KB 0 downloads
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a male

male in full color resize.jpg 173.33KB 0 downloads

male in full color full zoom in.jpg 104.88KB 0 downloads
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a juvenile, I think it's a male because of the ring on its tail

juvenile elassoma gilberti resize.jpg 69.75KB 0 downloads
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a shy male

he is shy.jpg 232.14KB 0 downloads
http://gallery.nanfa...is shy.jpg.html

Edited by EricaWieser, 07 October 2011 - 05:06 PM.

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#711 Guest_frogwhacker_*

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 05:28 PM

Good pictures. Nice looking fish too. Doesn't look like the inch of kitty litter caused any temporary cloudiness. Is that normal or do you have a specific method to avoid cloudiness when introducing it to an established tank?

Steve.

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#712 Guest_EricaWieser_*

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 07:21 PM

Good pictures. Nice looking fish too. Doesn't look like the inch of kitty litter caused any temporary cloudiness. Is that normal or do you have a specific method to avoid cloudiness when introducing it to an established tank?

Steve.

Thanks.

I used my Python siphon (which is a hose that runs from the sink to the fish tank) to mostly empty the tank. Then, when there were like four inches of water, I added the kitty litter. I added it slowly, by the handful, to avoid trapping any fish. Then I filled the tank a little, drained it a little, and filled it all the way. A slow water flow like the sink-hose-connection doesn't kick up the substrate at all, so it filled crystal clear like this.

Here is a picture of the tank that was taken seconds after filling it.

tank immediately after filling with flash.jpg 158.73KB 0 downloads
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If you don't have a hose that goes from your sink to your tank, you can achieve the same clear water upon filling by dumping your water not directly onto the substrate, but instead into a deep cooking pot. It will fill the pot and dribble slowly onto the substrate with each bucket you pour in. This method also avoids cloudiness. But I really recommend the sink-tank hose. I just turn the water on in the sink and watch as the tank empties and fills itself. I never have to lift another bucket again

I waited too long to buy myself one, really.

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#713 Guest_frogwhacker_*

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 08:00 PM

You're quite lucky to have an unlimited water supply. Where I live, I don't have access to a municipal water source. My water supply comes from a cistern and I'm limited to what rain I catch off the house roof. A python uses about 3 times more water than a regular siphon and bucket system to empty the same amount of water from a tank. All of my tanks together total about 300 gallons. 20%-30% of that for weekly water changes adds up, so I have to stick to the old fashioned bucket and siphon system that only disposes of what water comes out of the tank.

I have used the method of putting a small bucket in a tank to fill it with water to keep the substrate from stirring with surprising success. I was intrigued by what method you used to add the kitty litter substrate to the established tank without cloudiness as I just recently converted a tank with gravel substrate to a planted tank with a "soil base-sand capped" substrate with water and fish still in it. It's still fresh in my mind, so I'm finding it quite interesting to see how others go about something similar. By your pictures, it's obvious that it works well. Thanks for the reply.

Steve.

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#714 Guest_EricaWieser_*

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 08:41 PM

You're quite lucky to have an unlimited water supply. Where I live, I don't have access to a municipal water source. My water supply comes from a cistern and I'm limited to what rain I catch off the house roof. A python uses about 3 times more water than a regular siphon and bucket system to empty the same amount of water from a tank. All of my tanks together total about 300 gallons. 20%-30% of that for weekly water changes adds up, so I have to stick to the old fashioned bucket and siphon system that only disposes of what water comes out of the tank.

I have used the method of putting a small bucket in a tank to fill it with water to keep the substrate from stirring with surprising success. I was intrigued by what method you used to add the kitty litter substrate to the established tank without cloudiness as I just recently converted a tank with gravel substrate to a planted tank with a "soil base-sand capped" substrate with water and fish still in it. It's still fresh in my mind, so I'm finding it quite interesting to see how others go about something similar. By your pictures, it's obvious that it works well. Thanks for the reply.

Steve.

If you wanted to conserve water, you could use the sink connection only to fill the tank. The sink connection does waste water while draining the tank, this is true, but not during filling.
I grew up in Cleveland next to Lake Erie where water is cheap, so water conservation isn't something I ever had to deal with. But I guess I could empty the tank using the gravity siphon method, and only use the sink-hose to fill it. That way no water would be wasted.

How did you manage to install a "soil base-sand capped' substrate with water and fish still in the tank? That's impressive. I'm not even sure how that would work. How many of your fish died? You can pm me if you feel like it's too off topic to reply in this Elassoma gilberti post. I'm honestly curious.

Edited by EricaWieser, 07 October 2011 - 08:42 PM.

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#715 Guest_frogwhacker_*

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 08:56 PM

Good idea on using a tap attachment to fill the tank, but I better stick with a more labor intensive method to keep myself from getting to many tanks going at once. lol.

No fish died during the conversion. Most of them seemed kind of fascinated with what was going on and seemed quite hungry afterwards. Actually barely clouded the water at all. In less than an hour it was as clear as it was before I started. It wasn't a very high-tech method, so it might not be real impressive. Being a little off topic here, I could post the process in another section if you think it would be worthy. Not sure what section it should be in though...Captive care, general discussion, or native plants? Let me know if you think I should post it somewhere. I took pictures too. Thanks

Steve.

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#716 Guest_EricaWieser_*

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 09:42 PM

Sure, I'd like to see this setup. Any of those categories work. Did you use native plants? Maybe in there? Yeah, that would make for an interesting read.

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#717 Guest_frogwhacker_*

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 09:49 PM

Yeah, most of the plants are collected from local ponds. I'll try to get the pictures together and post something before tomorrow. Prepare yourself to laugh at some of my low tech, redneck ingenuity. Thanks.
Steve.

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#718 Guest_EricaWieser_*

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Posted 08 October 2011 - 08:15 PM

I was watching the fish today and I caught something kind of interesting on tape. There is a male in the left side of the tank who seems to alternately chase females away and invite them into his plants. It would make sense if he had eggs there, but he can't; I covered them all with kitty litter two days ago. The eggs are either covered in an inch of clay or they hatched and exist as fry swimming among the plants. At least one did hatch, by the way, because I saw a fry earlier today. Anyway, my point is, here is a video with two different dances performed by the same male Elassoma gilberti six minutes apart from one another. He ends the first dance by charging the female and scaring her away, and six minutes later ends a second dance by inviting her into his plants to spawn.

Edited by EricaWieser, 08 October 2011 - 08:16 PM.

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#719 Michael Wolfe

Board of Directors

North Georgia, Oconee River Drainage

Posted 09 October 2011 - 08:34 PM

I know you believe in peace and harmony, and I hope you can maintain it... but I have seen (and even have some bad video) of Elassoma "hitting" each other prety hard... This was two males in a ten gallon tank, so maybe if there is enough turf, you dont have to have a turf war... This was also during feeding... I have seen defending of a known feeding territory as a repeatable behaviour, so maybe you can help that by plentiful feeding, or even by feeding in multiple locations?

Here is a youtube version of the old bad video I have... one zonatum swimming along... at about second 26-28 he notices that he may have gone into the wrong space... in second 29... bam!

Either write something worth reading or do something worth writing. - Benjamin Franklin